United Aircraft Corp.Download PDFNational Labor Relations Board - Board DecisionsDec 8, 1969179 N.L.R.B. 935 (N.L.R.B. 1969) Copy Citation UNITED AIRCRAFT CORP. 935 United Aircraft Corporation (Pratt & Whitney Division ) and Local Lodge 1746, International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers, AFL-CIO and Carrel Lodge No. 700, International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers, AFL-CIO and Local Lodger 1746 -A, International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers, AFL-CIO United Aircraft Corporation ( Hamilton Standard Division ) and Local Lodge 743, International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers, AFL-CIO. Cases 1-CA-5681, 1-CA-5987, 1-CA-6011, 1-CA-6317, 1-CA-5710, 1-CA-5986, and 1-CA-5682 December 8, 1969 DECISION AND ORDER BY MEMBERS FANNING, JENKINS, AND ZAGORIA On August 12, 1968, Trial Examiner Paul E. Weil issued his Decision, and, on August 20, 1968, his Decision and Supplemental Decision in the above-entitled consolidated proceeding, finding that the Respondent had engaged in and was engaging in certain unfair labor practices and recommending that it cease and desist therefrom and take certain affirmative action, as set forth in the attached Trial Examiner's Decisions. The Trial Examiner further found that Respondent had not engaged in certain other unfair labor practices alleged in the complaint and recommended that those allegations be dismissed. Thereafter, the Respondent, the Charging Parties, and the General Counsel filed exceptions to the Trial Examiner's Decisions and supporting briefs, and the General Counsel and Charging Parties filed answering briefs. Pursuant to the provisions of Section 3(b) of the National Labor Relations Act, as amended, the National Labor Relations Board has delegated its powers in connection with these cases to a three-member panel. The Board has reviewed the rulings of the Trial Examiner made at the hearing and finds that no prejudicial error was committed. The rulings are hereby affirmed. The Board has considered the Trial Examiner's Decision, the Supplemental Decision, the exceptions, the briefs, and the entire record in these cases and hereby adopts the findings,' conclusions, and recommendations of the Trial Examiner, as modified below.' 'The Respondent excepts to many of the Trial Examiner's credibility findings. It is the Board's established policy, however, not to overrule a Trial Examiner's resolutions with respect to credibility unless, as is not the case here, the preponderance of all the relevant evidence convinces us that the resolutions are incorrect. Standard Dry Wall Products. Inc., 91 NLRB 544, enfd. 188 F.2d 362 (C.A. 3), We are also satisfied, on the basis of the e4re record, that the Respondent' s allegations as to the Trial Examiner's prejudging of the issues and to his conduct during the hearing are without merit 'Subsequent to the issuance of the Trial Examiner's Decisions in these 1. The Trial Examiner found and the record clearly establishes that the Respondent3 violated Section 8(a)(1) by coercive interrogation, threats, warnings, and seizure of a union authorization card; and violated Section 8(a)(3) by discharging stewards Menard, Nelson, Gahagan, and DeMerchant, and suspending steward Tardiff. We further find, contrary to the Trial Examiner, that the Respondent also discharged stewards D'Andrea and Brandt for discriminatory reasons in violation of Section 8 (a)(3). Most of the Section 8(a)(1) conduct engaged in by the Respondent related to the investigations of stewards for alleged violations of company rules and/or contract provisions prohibiting union solicitation and activity on company or working time. The investigations were conducted by members of the Respondent's internal security department, and during the course of the investigations the steward involved was interrogated at length by two security officers in a coercive and accusatory atmosphere. As found by the Trial Examiner, Kenneth Menard was elected shop steward at the Respondent's Middletown plant in September 1966. A day or two later, as part of his duties as steward, he approached several employees to get their name, address, and clock number. Shortly thereafter, his foreman, Karlon, initiated an investigation by reporting that Menard had solicited employee Guyette to join the Union. From this report, which subsequently was proven false," the Respondent undertook an extensive investigation which not only included lengthy interrogation of Menard, but also the questioning of foreman Karlon and several employees in his department, some of them more than once. During his session with the investigators, which lasted nearly 4 hours, Menard was confronted with false and inconsistent statements obtained from others and asked repeatedly to admit soliciting for the Union on company time. Menard protested that he had only carried out instructions to obtain names and addresses, largely during his lunchbreak. The investigators told Menard that in such cases as his, the company took into consideration whether the employee subsequently quit the Union, and that cases, Trial Examiner Ivar H Peterson issued his Decision in United Aircraft Corporation , Cases 1-CA-6475 and 1-CA-6602 The Charging Parties and the General Counsel have moved that the latter cases be consolidated with the instant cases on the ground that similar issues are involved However, in view of our determination herein, we find it unnecessary to consolidate, and therefore deny the motions Other documents subsequently filed by the parties are treated below 'The Respondent's plants involved in these proceedings are Pratt & Whitney Division plants in Connecticut at East Hartford and Manchester, represented by Lodge 1746 , at Middletown, represented by Lodge 700, and at Southington, represented by Lodge 1746-A, and the Hamilton Standard Division plants at Windsor Locks and Broad Brook, Connecticut, represented by Lodge 743 'Guyette and Karlon both testified that Guyette did not tell Karlon that he had been solicited to join the Union but rather told him that he had been asked for his name, clock number, and address Moreover, when the security investigators interviewed Guyette on October 17, he told them that Menard asked only for his name, clock number, and address 179 NLRB No. 160 936 DECISIONS OF NATIONAL LABOR RELATIONS BOARD employees in the past who had been involved in similar cases and had quit the Union were still working for Pratt & Whitney. Menard then signed a statement prepared by the investigators admitting that he had conducted union business during working time . Following this " interview " Menard returned to his work station where foreman Karlon suggested that "it might help out if I (Menard) did quit the Union;" and Menard mailed his letter of resignation to the Union. In connection with its inquiries into Menard's activities, the Respondent called employees Frank Partridge, Raymond Desloges, and Armand Morin individually to the internal security office. Morin was interviewed on two occasions. Partridge was warned that "nothing that is said in this room is to be repeated outside of this room. If it is you will be back here." The investigators then told him that the Respondent had evidence that he had been discussing Union matters on company time. When Partridge denied this allegation , the investigators accused him of discussing union business with Menard on company time and showed him three pictures of Menard. Partridge then told them that the only conversation he had with Menard was when Menard introduced himself and welcomed Partridge to the department. As to Desloges, even after he had made clear to the investigators that the only approach made to him with regard to the Union had been in the parking lot, the interrogators persisted in asking him if anyone else had asked him to join the Union during working hours, and inquired as to who had approached him on the parking lot. The Trial Examiner found that Nicholas D'Andrea became a union steward in April 1967 and soon thereafter filed a grievance against foreman Mason for assigning work unfairly. Consequently, several employees who had lost the extra overtime they had received before the grievance was filed, decided to report to Mason that D'Andrea had engaged in union activity in violation of the rules . The internal security department immediately began sweeping investigations of this report, obtaining statements from many employees, only two of whom the Trial Examiner credited, that D'Andrea had asked them to join the Union on working time. D'Andrea was subjected to questioning on 2 successive days during which the investigators raised their voices, shouted, and "hollered at" him. The investigators told him "we know you're guilty, and we're going to prove it," and even refused to allow him to go to the washroom alone because, as one of them told him, "I thought you were running away." As a result of the overbearing and coercive manner in which the investigations were conducted, D'Andrea became ill and required medical attention on both occasions. John Tardiff was a shop steward and union committeeman in November 1967. On November 20, 1967, he was ordered to report to internal security where he was told the Respondent possessed employee statements in which he was accused of passing out employees' merit ratings' during company time. He admitted passing out the slips but said that to his knowledge he had not passed them out on company time. After rephrasing their inquiry several different ways and receiving Tardiff's denials and his refusal to sign a prepared statement, the investigators allowed Tardiff to return to his job. Tardiff testified that it takes about 3 seconds to pass out a merit rating. Although, as the Trial Examiner found, Tardiff did not distribute the ratings on working time, Tardiff was suspended for 3 days allegedly for violating company rules. Employee Lancelot sent a letter to the Respondent saying that he had been discriminated against in the assignment of work. As a result Lancelot was interviewed by a personnel advisor to whom he repeated the statement in his letter. Although this accusation related primarily to Lancelot's foreman, no investigation of this accusation was made. Instead, the Respondent launched an investigation of Nelson, the union steward in Lancelot's department, based on Lancelot's statement to the personnel advisor that Nelson solicited him during working hours to join the Union. Several other employees in Nelson's department were summoned by the security investigators. Although all stated that they were solicited on nonworking time, as the Trial Examiner found, the investigators obtained their signatures to affidavits deliberately worded to imply that Nelson's solicitation had occurred on working time. Nelson was sent to the internal security department by his foreman. During his interrogation, which lasted over 2 hours, Nelson was asked repeatedly whether he had solicited employees for the Union on company time. Although he refused to sign a statement prepared for him, and, as the Trial Examiner found, had not solicited on working time, he was given a choice of being discharged or quitting, and chose the latter.' 'Merit ratings, which are apparently used when employees are considered for promotion or transfer, are given to the union stewards to furnish to the employees 'The investigation of Howard R Rooney, another steward, was the result of a conversation he had with employee Joyce Carroll during which she offered to return a copy of the Union contract that she had borrowed from Rooney Shortly thereafter, Cochran, Rooney's foreman, asked why he had been talking to Carroll and what he was doing with the contract Rooney explained that it was his copy and that Carroll had offered to return it, whereupon Cochran said, "Mr , when you put that (union) badge on, you're on thin ice " Cochran immediately went to Carroll who apparently told him that Rooney had not been carrying on union business and verified Rooney's account of the conversation Nevertheless the investigation continued The security investigators first called in Carroll, and even though she confirmed that no solicitation was involved, summoned Rooney Rooney was required to spend about an hour in the internal security department during which he was asked repeatedly whether he was certain that he had not tried to solicit Carroll for the Union Rooney refused to sign a statement prepared for him by the investigators and subsequently quit his job The Trial Examiner found, and we agree, that the interrogation of Rooney was coercive and in violation of Sec 8(a)(1) of the Act UNITED AIRCRAFT CORP. The Respondent asserts that the above investigations were conducted for the purpose of enforcing a contract provision and company rules prohibiting union solicitation and activity on company or working time. The above evidence clearly establishes, however, as the Trial Examiner found, that they were actually conducted for the purpose of harassing the union stewards involved, making them realize that their union activities were being watched closely by the Respondent, and to garner enough evidence to support subsequent discharges. Thus, (1) the Respondent admittedly had knowledge of their roles as union stewards; (2) although all four were allegedly disciplined for conducting union business on company time for periods of from 3 seconds to a few minutes, the Respondent conducted widespread investigations lasting as long as 2 weeks, even though the evidence obtained was false, biased, minimal , or distorted, in an attempt to support its disciplinary actions against the union stewards involved; (3) the investigators behaved toward the employees being interviewed in an overbearing and intimidating manner, and infringing on their statutory rights by coercive interrogation; (4) the Respondent's demonstrated hostility toward unionism and proclivity towards violating the Act as established by its unlawful conduct described herein. In these circumstances, we find that whether or not stewards Menard, Nelson, and Tardiff actually engaged in union solicitation or activity during working time, this was merely a pretext to conceal the Respondent's discriminatory motive in disciplining them. Moreover, we find, contrary to the Trial Examiner, that the discharge of steward Nicholas D'Andrea cannot be abstracted from Respondent's other unlawful activities, nor should it be viewed separately from that of the other stewards. Against this background, including the Respondent's unlawful interrogation of D'Andrea, we find that the reason asserted by the Respondent for D'Andrea's discharge was also a pretext to conceal its real motive of ridding itself of another active union steward. The Trial Examiner found, and we agree, that the Respondent discharged stewards Hattie Gahagan and Winston DeMerchant on April 23, 1968, because of their union activities,, in violation of Section 8(a)(3) and (1) of the Act. The Respondent's asserted reason for the discharges of Gahagan and DeMerchant was that they solicited union membership during working hours in violation of company rules. Both Gahagan and DeMerchant testified credibly that they had not solicited during company t ime and Respondent offered no evidence to the contrary. We further find, contrary to the Trial Examiner, that the discharge of steward Dennis Brandt also violated the Act. Brandt, a shop steward, was terminated on April 11, 1968, for a "violation of company rules." In response to the allegation in the complaint that Brandt was 9 37 discharged because of his union activities, Respondent produced no evidence other than its investigative files which it contends were the basis of the discharge. The files contained information regarding union solicitation during working hours and posting union stickers on walls. The Trial Examiner was unable to determine from the files the basis of the Respondent's decision to discharge Brandt, and, consequently, found that the General Counsel had not sustained the burden of proving the violation. The Respondent's files reveal that its investigation of Brandt, a known union steward, provided no basis for discharging him for solicitation during work time, which Brandt denied on the stand. Brandt did admit to posting a 3-inch union sticker in the men's room. While the Respondent apparently had never disciplined others for putting up stickers that appeared from time to time in the men's room, Brandt was summarily discharged. In these circumstances, and in view of the Respondent's discrimination against other union stewards described above and its other unfair labor practices found herein, we find that the motivating cause for Brandt's discharge was his union activity. We, therefore, find that Brandt's discharge violated Section 8(a)(3) and (1) of the Act. 2. The Trial Examiner further found that the Respondent violated Section 8(a)(5) by refusing, during the term of its 2-year contract entered into on September 8, 1966, with Lodge 1746, the services of Lodge 1746 stewards, requested by employees who sought to discuss grievances and by certain employees named above when called to the Respondent's internal security office prior to discharge. Although the Respondent in its answer to the 8(a)(5) allegations of the complaint' denied that Lodge 1746 was the majority representative of the employees involved, the Trial Examiner refused to permit the Respondent to litigate its contention that it had no duty to bargain with the Union. The Trial Examiner relied on the Board's decision in United Aircraft Corporation (Case 1-CA-5345 and 5372), 168 NLRB No. 66, finding inter alia that the Respondent unlawfully withdrew recognition from Lodge 1746 on March 10 and 11, 1966, and ordering the Respondent to bargain with that Union. However, subsequent to the Trial Examiner's Decision herein, the United States Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit denied enforcement8 of the Board's order to bargain with Local 1746 in United Aircraft Corporation (Case 1-CA-5345 and 5372), on the basis of the Court's 'An allegation covering the Respondent's refusal to provide a Lodge 1746-A steward during the predischarge interview with employee D'Andrea, who worked at the Southington plant, was specifically stricken from the complaint by the General Counsel's amendment dated November 30, 1967. In these circumstances, and as the Trial Examiner did not base his 8(a)(5) findings on the Respondent's conduct toward D'Andrea, we find no violation of Sec. 8(a)(5) by the Respondent with regard to Lodge 1746-A 'United Aircraft Corporation v N L R B, 416 F 2d 809 (C A D C) 938 DECISIONS OF NATIONAL LABOR RELATIONS BOARD finding of sufficient evidence to cast serious doubt on the Union 's continued majority status and the absence of evidence that the Union enjoyed such status . Thereafter , the Respondent filed a Motion in the instant cases requesting the Board to give effect to the Court 's decision in Cases 1-CA-5345 and 5372, by dismissing all 8(a)(5 ) allegations herein. In opposition to the Respondent ' s Motion, the Charging Parties filed a Reply and a Supplemental Reply, and the General Counsel filed an Answer and a Motion to Reopen the Record . The Charging Parties and the General Counsel urge the Board to reopen the record to receive additional evidence, and find that the Respondent cannot challenge the Union 's majority during the period material herein. They contend that the Court ' s decision was concerned only with the Union ' s majority status as of March 10 and 11, 1966 , when the Respondent withdrew recognition; that 6 months later the Respondent negotiated the 1966 contract involved herein and relied on its terms in its defense to the charges in these cases . The Unions and the General Counsel offer evidence that in 1968 the Respondent, after initially challenging majority status, thereafter renegotiated and entered into subsequent contracts with these Unions when the Unions offered to submit authorization cards or participate in an election ; they also offer evidence of current majority status as of April 1969. We find no merit in these contentions . As the . Respondent had no obligation to bargain in March 1966 , as the court held, it had no such obligation 6 months later , or at any time material herein , because, aside from other considerations , the Respondent , as in the prior case, continued to challenge the Union's majority status and there is no evidence , and none is offered, that the Union in fact enjoyed such status. Even if the Respondent withdrew its challenge at the time the subsequent contract was negotiated in 1968, and even if the Union represented a clear majority in 1969, such facts are irrelevant to the issue of majority status in 1966 and 1967. Nor do we agree that the Respondent waived its right to defend against the 8(a)(5) allegations on this ground by entering into the 1966-68 contract with the Union. It is clear that that contract was negotiated in compliance with an injunction issued by a United States District Court on August 5, 1966 , directing the Respondent to restore recognition and resume bargaining . pending litigation , in Cases 1-CA-5345 and 5372, of its obligations under the Act.9 No such obligation having been found to exist, the Respondent cannot be penalized for obeying the District Court ' s Order or for relying on provisions of the contract as an alternate defense herein. As the Respondent 's obligation to honor employee requests for Union stewards was dependent upon the majority status of the Union, 'As the District Court noted , the Respondent specifically preserved its position on this issue in the contract and as the majority status of Lodge 1746 was not established during the relevant period, we find that the Respondent did not violate Section 8(a)(5) by denying such requests. ORDER Pursuant to Section 10(c) of the National Labor Relations Act, as amended, the National Labor Relations Board hereby orders that the Respondent, United Aircraft Corporation (Pratt & Whitney Division), East Hartford, Manchester, Southington, and Middletown, Connecticut; (Hamilton Standard Division), Windsor Locks and Broad Brook, Connecticut; their officers, agents, successors, and assigns, shall: 1. Cease and desist from: (a) Coercively interrogating or intimidating employees in connection with their union membership, sympathies, or activities. (b) Threatening employees with reprisal for their union membership or activities. (c) Discouraging membership in Local Lodges 1746 or 1746-A, International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers, AFL-CIO, or in any other labor organization, by discharging or in any other manner discriminating against employees because they engage in concerted or union activities. (d) In any other manner interfering with, restraining, or coercing employees in the exercise of the rights guaranteed them in the Act. 2. Take the following affirmative action which the Board finds will effectuate the policies of the Act: (a) Offer to Kenneth Menard, Clifford Nelson, Nicholas D'Andrea, Hattie Gahagan, Winston DeMerchant, and Dennis Brandt immediate, full, and unconditional reinstatement in their former, or substantially equivalent positions of employment without prejudice to their seniority or other rights and privileges, and reimburse them for any loss of pay suffered as a result of the discrimination against them in the manner set forth in F. W. Woolworth Company, 90 NLRB 289, 291-93, and Isis Plumbing & Heating Co., 188 NLRB 716. (b) Make whole John W. Tardiff for the wages lost as the result of the discrimination against him. (c) Preserve and, upon request, make available to the Board or its agents for examination and copying, all payroll records, social security payment records, timecards, personnel records and reports, and all other records necessary to analyze the amount of backpay due under the terms of this Order. (d) Notify the above-named employees if presently serving in the Armed Forces of the United States of their right to full reinstatement upon application in accordance with the Selective Service Act and the Universal Military Training and Service Act, as amended, after discharge from the Armed Forces. (e) Post at its above specified places of business, UNITED AIRCRAFT CORP. 939 copies of the attached notice marked "Appendix."10 Copies of said notices, on forms provided by the Regional Director for Region 1, after being duly signed by the Respondent's representative, shall be posted by the Respondent immediately upon receipt thereof, and be maintained by it for 60 consecutive days thereafter, in conspicuous places, including all places where notices to employees are customarily posted. Reasonable steps shall be taken by the Respondent to insure that said notices are not altered, defaced, or-covered by any other material. (f) Notify the Regional Director for Region 1, in writing, within 10 days from the date of this Decision, what steps have been taken to comply herewith. IT IS FURTHER ORDERED that the complaint, insofar as it alleges unfair labor practices other than those found herein, be, and it hereby is, dismissed. "In the event this Order is enforced by a judgment of the United States Court of Appeals, the words in the notice reading "Posted by Order of the National Labor Relations Board " shall read "Posted pursuant to a Judgment of the United States of Appeals enforcing an Order of the National Labor Relations Board " APPENDIX NOTICE TO EMPLOYEES Posted by Order of The National Labor Relations Board , an agency of the United States Government WE WILL NOT discourage membership in Local Lodges 1746 or 1746-A, International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers, AFL-CIO, or any other labor organization , by discharging or otherwise discriminating against employees because they engage in union activities. WE WILL NOT interrogate , intimidate, or threaten employees with reprisals for engaging in union activities. WE WILL NOT in any manner interfere with, restrain, or coerce our employees in the exercise of their rights guaranteed by Section 7 of the Act. WE WILL immediately reinstate stewards Kenneth Menard, Clifford Nelson, Nicholas D'Andrea, Hattie Gahagan, Winston DeMerchant, and Dennis Brandt to their former or substantially equivalent jobs, and pay them any money they lost as a result of the discrimination against them ; and WE WILL pay John W. Tardiff the wages he lost as a result of our discrimination against him. WE WILL notify the above-named employees if presently serving in the Armed Forces of the United States of their right to full reinstatement upon application in accordance with the Selective Service Act and the Universal Military Training and Service Act, as amended , after discharge from the Armed Forces. Dated By UNITED AIRCRAFT CORPORATION , PRATT & WHITNEY DIVISION AND HAMILTON STANDARD DIVISION (Employer) (Representative ) (Title) This notice must remain posted for 60 consecutive days from the date of posting and must not be altered, defaced, or covered by any other material. Any questions concerning this notice or compliance with its provisions, may be directed to the Board's Office, 20th Floor, John F. Kennedy Federal Building, Cambridge and New Sudbury Streets, Boston, Massachusetts 02203, Telephone 617-223-3300. TRIAL EXAMINER'S DECISION STATEMENT OF THE CASE PAUL E. WEIL, Trial Examiner: Charges and amended charges were filed on October 10 and December 29, 1966, respectively, by Local Lodge 1746, International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers, AFL-CIO, hereinafter called Lodge 1746, against United Aircraft Company (Pratt & Whitney Division), hereinafter called Respondent Pratt & Whitney (1-CA-5681), on October 10, 1966, by Local Lodge 743, International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers, AFL-CIO, hereinafter called Lodge 743, against United Aircraft Corporation (Hamilton Standard Division), hereinafter called Respondent Hamilton (1-CA-5682); on November 7, 1966, by Canel Lodge No. 700, International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers, AFL-CIO, hereinafter called Lodge 700, against Respondent Pratt & Whitney (1-CA-5710); on June 21, 1966, and amended September 26, 1967, by Local Lodge 1746-A, International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers, AFL-CIO, hereinafter called Lodge 1746-A, against Respondent Pratt & Whitney (I-CA-5986); on June 21, 1967, by Lodge 1746 against Respondent Pratt & Whitney (1-CA-5987); on July 1, 1967, by Lodge 1746 against Respondent Pratt & Whitney, amended September 26, 1967 (1-CA-6011). The General Counsel issued a complaint on charge 1-CA-5710 on December 21, 1966, and thereafter consolidated each of the other cases above set forth and issued an amended complaint on September 29, 1967, which amended complaint was in turn amended at various times thereafter before and during the hearing herein.' By motion dated May 31, 1968, the General Counsel moved to reopen the hearing, consolidate Case I-CA-6317, and amend the already much amended complaint Opposition was duly filed by Respondents and the motion was granted, with the hearing noticed for July 15, 1968 By answers duly filed and after a plethora of collateral pleadings and a pretrial conference, the issues were joined and the matter came on for hearing commencing December 18, 1967, continuing on various dates thereafter for a total of 18 days and finishing March 13, 1968, resuming July 15 and concluding July 22. With all parties represented I heard the case in Hartford, Connecticut. Briefs were filed by each of the parties and have been duly considered. Upon the entire record in the case and from my observation of the witnesses and their demeanor, I make the following. 'General Counsel 's motion made on January 30, 1968, at the close of his case-in-chief, to further amend the consolidated and already much amended complaint by the addition of allegations regarding Respondent's alleged rejection and refusal to honor checkoff authorization cards involving some 87 employees at 3 of Respondent 's plants was denied on the ground that the amendment sought did not state a cause of action in terms of the Act 940 DECISIONS OF NATIONAL LABOR RELATIONS BOARD FINDINGS OF FACT 1. THE BUSINESS OF RESPONDENTS B Issues The General Counsel contends that the Union, after losing a strike in 1960 and suffering years of weakness, is "resurgent" in that it is gaining adherents and attempting to better service the employees with a view toward further gains in membership. The chief visible presence of the Union is embodied in its shop stewards who are equipped with distinctive badges and wear uniform colored shirts with the IAM designation on them. In addition to representing the employees in grievances, stewards are the most effective organizing arms of the Union. All of the alleged unfair labor practices dealt with in this proceeding have as their basic subject matter the stewards, their rights, their duties, their limitations, and the number of them that are recognized by Respondents. The complaint alleges that Respondent Pratt & Whitney violated Section 8(a)(1) of the Act by interrogating employees about the activities of stewards and by interrogating stewards about their own activities, "coercively and excessively." Respondent contends with regard to these allegations that it did no more than normal investigation of alleged breaches of its no-solicitation rule and of a contractual provision that "there shall be no solicitation of employees for union membership or dues conducted upon the premises of the Company during working hours by the Union, its representatives or by employees " The complaint, as amended, alleges that Respondent Pratt & Whitney threatened stewards with reprisals for engaging in lawful protected steward activities, intimidated and interrogated stewards, appropriated signed union cards, and discriminatorily enforced its no-solicitation rule. Respondent denies the utterance of the alleged threats and denies the discriminatory enforcement of the no-solicitation rule. It is further alleged that Respondent Pratt & Whitney constructively discharged a steward, Nelson, discharged stewards Menard, D'Andrea, Brandt, Gahagan, and DeMerchant and discriminated against steward Tardiff Respondent contends that Nelson and Menard quit, D'Andrea, Brandt, Gahagan, and DeMerchant were discharged for cause and that there was no discrimination with regard to Tardiff General Counsel contends that the Respondents refused to bargain with Lodges 1746 and 743 by the following acts and conduct. (1) By unilaterally changing the "historic shop steward-employee ratio formula agreed to originally in 1950 " (2) By an oral threat uttered by Attorney Wells to Attorney Ratner to repudiate the "historic shop steward-employee ratio formula" unless the Charging Party made concessions on matters originally agreed to be binding terms of an agreement. (3) By refusal to furnish information regarding population in the departments by shifts, up-to-date steward area maps, and other data. (4) By the refusal to call shop stewards and process grievances through normal channels during three periods of time: (a) Between withdrawal of recognition and the signing of new contracts on September 26; (b) between September 26 and December 12, 1966, during which time agreement on the number of shop stewards and the designation of such shop stewards had not been reached; and Respondent Pratt & Whitney operates plants in East Hartford, Middletown, Southington, and Manchester, Connecticut. Respondent Hamilton operates plants in Broad Brook and Windsor Locks, Connecticut. Both are subsidiaries of United Aircraft Corporation. At their various plants Respondents are engaged in the manufacture, sale, and distribution of aircraft components and electronic devices. In the operation of their enterprises each of the Respondents annually receive goods and materials valued in excess of $1 million at their plants in the State of Connecticut shipped from points outside the State of Connecticut, and ship substantial quantities of their products in interstate commerce from their Connecticut plants to other States of the Union. Respondents are engaged in commerce within the meaning of Section 2(6) and (7) of the Act. II. THE LABOR ORGANIZATIONS INVOLVED Lodges 700, 743, 1746, and 1746-A are each labor organizations within the meaning of Section 2(5) of the Act. III. THE ALLEGED UNFAIR LABOR PRACTICES A. Background Lodge 1746 was certified by the Board as the collective-bargaining representative of employees in Respondent Pratt & Whitney's East Hartford plant in 1945. Lodge 743 was certified by the Board as the collective-bargaining representative of employees of Respondent Hamilton at its Windsor Locks plant in 1941, and at its Broad Brook plant in 1954. Lodge 1746-A was certified by the Board as the collective-bargaining representative of the employees in a unit at Respondent Pratt & Whitney's Southington plant in 1951. Collective bargaining relations existed between the two Respondents and Lodges 1746 and 743 until March 2, 1966, at which time Respondents withdrew recognition during contract negotiations.' Thereafter pursuant to an injunction action before the United States District Court for the District of Connecticut, Respondents resumed recognition and entered into contracts with those two lodges. Respondent Pratt & Whitney has continued recognition of Lodge 1746-A in its unit at all times relevant hereto. On November 27, 1967, the Board found that Respondents had violated Section 8(a)(5) of the National Labor Relations Act, as amended, in refusing to bargain with Lodges 1746 and 743 and directed that Respondents bargain with those lodges as representatives of the employees at the Broad Brook and Windsor Locks plants and at the East Hartford and Manchester plants.' The allegations concerned herein deal with the relationships between, Respondents and the various lodges after the withdrawal of recognition and until the present. 'Although recognition was withdrawn on March 2, it appears that contractual relations continued until the then existing contracts expired, a matter of a month or two. '168 NLRB No. 66. I take administrative notice of the Board' s Decision therein UNITED AIRCRAFT CORP. 941 (c) after December 12. (5) By refusing to call a shop steward to assist other shop stewards being interrogated by Respondent's security officers. As to the refusal-to-bargain allegations Respondents contend that (a) there is no historic shop steward-employee ratio formula, (b) Attorney Wells' statements to Attorney Ratner did not constitute a threat of repudiation of an agreed on contractual provision, (c) Respondents furnished all relevant information requested to the extent that such information was available, (d) during the period from the withdrawal of recognition until December 12 when agreement was reached on the number of stewards, their areas and designation, it was impossible to follow the usual grievance procedure because, under the terms of the contract, designated stewards only could be called and none had been designated. As to the refusal to call stewards after December 12, Respondents contend that if any such incidents in fact occurred they are attributable to mistakes reasonably to be anticipated under the circumstances that there are large numbers of supervisors and over 20,000 employees, wherefore a reasonable margin of error must be afforded in deciding whether a given request that a steward be called falls within the limits in the contract, which provides what type of complaints of employees are grievable through the contractual grievance procedure. The 8(a)(5) allegations require inquiry into two basic issues: (1) whether a "historic shop steward-employee ratio formula" existed as a term or condition of employment, and (2) the extent to which employees have an absolute right to representation by a shop steward in their dealings with the employer. C. The 8(a)(1) and (3) Allegations Most of the 8(a)(1) and (3) allegations relate to the alleged discharges of the stewards named above, each of whom was accused of soliciting for the Union on company time and terminated as a result thereof.' Each of the stewards was the subject of an investigation by members of the Employers' internal security force during the course of which each was interrogated by two security officers on one or more occasions. The General Counsel contends that the interrogations were coercive and "excessive" and that the investigations of the alleged violations by the stewards of company rules were more comprehensive and searching than investigations by the internal security department of other employees for breaches of company rules unconnected with the Union. Thus, the General Counsel contends that not only the content of the investigation gave rise to violations but that the nature and 'extent of the investigations discloses a pattern of coercion directed at employees and shop stewards and directly attributable to the fact that their activities involved the Union. We shall first consider the facts with regard to the stewards. All parties have agreed that it is important to their future relationships to have the issues herein decided at the earliest possible date. Inasmuch as the issues concerning stewards Brandt , Gahagan, and DeMerchant, the subjects of the reopening of the hearing and the fourth amendment to the complaint, are cumulative to the similar issues tried earlier and discussed below, I believe that the overall policies of the Act will best be served by 'Rooney is not alleged to have been discharged . He in fact quit, allegedly because of harassment by his foreman. the forthwith issuance of the decision on the remainder of the case, reserving for a supplemental decision my discussion of the issues raised by the fourth amendment to the complaint. This cannot prejudice any of the parties concerned, for I shall have before me all the evidence in the earlier portion of the case for consideration of that produced in the latter, as well as the arguments addressed to the affected portions of the complaint in the parties' briefs.' 1. Kenneth R. Menard Kenneth Menard, inspector, was transferred to the Middletown plant on the second shift about September 16, 1966, when a new department was formed there. Shortly after his transfer Menard was elected shop steward and assigned, among his other duties, to obtain, if possible, the names, clock numbers, and addresses of each of the employees in the departments which he served.' Menard asked his leadman and then his foreman, Karlon, for the information. Karlon suggested that if Menard wanted the information he would have to get it on his own. A day or 2 later, after his shift ended, Menard approached an employee on the third shift who had recently been transferred to the plant. Menard introduced himself as the shop steward and welcomed the new employee to the plant and then left. Foreman Karlon testified that he was informed by other foremen and leadmen that Menard had approached them with the view to getting the information which Karlon had refused to divulge to him. He also testified that at 10 minutes past midnight, which was 10 minutes after the ending of Menard's shift, he saw Menard talking to an employee in another department. Karlon was accompanied at the time by the foreman of the other department. Karlon called Menard to his desk and told him that he had been found in another department before the shift, that he was seen at 10 minutes after 12 talking to another employee, and that in spite of Karlon's suggestion that Menard go back to the man who wanted the information and ask him for the proper procedure to get it, Menard persisted in attempting to get it through his own means. Karlon warned Menard that he was breaking the rules and told him to stop it. According to Karlon, Menard asked when he could get in contact with other people about union business and Karlon answered it was not his responsibility. Menard asked if he could leave messages on Karlon's desk for Karlon to deliver to employees and Karlon told him that he was not the U.S. mail. Menard then said that he would have to think of a "sneaky" way of doing it, whereupon Karlon warned him that he was not to conduct any type of union business on company time, either Menard's time or the time of the employees whom he might be contacting. The following day Karlon reported to the personnel section that an employee, Guyette, had asked him if he had to join the Union in order to work at the plant and 'Similar actions have been taken in the past by Trial Examiners, including Sidney Sherman in J W Mays, Inc, 147 NLRB 942, and Joseph I. Nachman in Schimmel Hotel Company, 147 NLRB 1378, as well as by the Board in Dubo Manufacturing Company. 142 NLRB 431 and 813. 'It appears that as a result of the injunction action which led to the signing of the contract, Respondents had supplied the Union with some requested information , but had declined to furnish the information concerning the names and addresses of employees in the unit. The Employer's refusal to furnish the requested information is not in issue in the instant proceeding. 942 DECISIONS OF NATIONAL LABOR RELATIONS BOARD informed him that the steward, whom he identified as Menard, had asked him to join the Union and to give his name, clock number, and address. An investigation ensued. Menard testified that he solicited 35 to 40 employees to join the Union after he became shop steward and that he asked all of the employees in his section, which numbered about 30, for their names, addresses, and clock numbers for the Union. He testified that he may or may not have solicited employees to join the Union during working time and that it was not until a few days before he was first spoken to by Karlon concerning his activities that he knew that he was not supposed to solicit for the Union during working hours. Thereafter, he testified, he did not do so. Under the circumstances that there were two lunch periods in his and surrounding sections it is not improbable that, as he testified, he could have been on his lunch hour and a person to whom he was talking or whom he was soliciting was on their working time He testified that at no time did he attempt to actually sign up an employee on working time because of the time required to have them fill out the union application and dues-deduction cards. The investigation was conducted by two security investigators, Vardon and Massett. It commenced with Karlon's report that Menard had solicited employee Guyette to join the Union. Why Karlon so stated must be left to the imagination. Both Guyette and Karlon testified that Guyette did not tell Karlon that he had been solicited to join the Union but rather told him that he had been asked for his name, clock number, and address. At any rate the security investigators interviewed Guyette on October 17 and took a statement from him in which he stated that while he was at the toolcrib in his department Menard came up to him and asked him for his name, clock number, and address. He gave Menard the information. Menard wrote it down and told him that soon he would be receiving papers in the mail about his base pay, hourly rate, and wages. He stated that he noticed that Menard had the name of Armand Morin in his notebook and he commented, "Oh you have another fellow from my department," to which Menard answered "yes." Guyette finished his statement saying, "I have not spoken with Menard since that time and he has not said anything to me about the Union or anything else and as yet I have not received any papers referred to by Menard in the mail." Vardon and Massett next interviewed Morin who gave them a statement saying that on the evening of the 14th or 15th, just after the luncheon break, Menard walked up to him, asked to see his badge, and wrote information in his notebook. He testified. After he wrote down my name he asked me for my home address . . . but I asked him anyway why he wanted it. He answered "You'll find out later." Then I gave him my address and he asked what the initial "A" was for on the badge and I told him Armand and even spelled it out for him. After he wrote all of this down in his note book he and Sloan just walked away from the area. Sloan didn't say anything to me at all during this Obviously neither Guyette nor Morin supplied evidence to support Foreman Karlon's report that Menard had solicited anyone to join the Jnion. After consultation with Thomas Connolly, their supervisor, the investigators then interviewed Karlon on October 18 Karlon signed a statement that Guyette had told him on the 14th that Menard had asked him for his address and "and also asked him if he wanted to join the Union " Why a statement was taken from Karlon was not adequately explained. It is clear that normally statements are not taken from foremen in investigations of this nature and normally statements are not taken from individuals who have no direct evidence to offer. Nevertheless, although the investigator recognized that Karlon provided only hearsay information and Karlon added nothing that had not already been found unsupported, Investigator Massett was able to testify only that he was ordered by Supervisor Connolly to interview Karlon ' On the 18th Karlon informed investigators that Menard had approached John Boucher. Boucher was interviewed on the 19th and told the investigators that Menard came to him while he was working and asked for his name, clock number, job code, and hourly rate. He asked why Menard wanted the information and Menard answered, "because the Union would like to know your name, clock number, job code and how much you make so they can send you a labor grade card to carry in your tool box " Later on in the shift Boucher said he met Menard in the men's room and Menard reminded him not to forget to give him the information and that he would pick it up the next night. He went on to say, "Since I have been in the Middletown Plant this is at least the fifth or sixth time that this man has approached me in the shop during working hours concerning joining the Union. The first time that he has talked to me about it was on the very first day that I was assigned to the Middletown Plant. I think that this was on September 26, 1966. 1 can definitely remember that on that day Menard came to me in the shop and said `would you like to join the Union.' He followed this by saying, `why don't you join the Union right now and then they would make you a union steward in your department "'8 Boucher went on to say that his leadman came over after Menard's visit and asked what Menard wanted and he told him that Menard had been asking him about joining the Union. On the following night Vardon and Massett again interviewed Boucher, this time taking a statement to the effect that the September 26 incident occurred while Boucher was working at his job Vardon and Massett testified that Boucher mentioned that Morin was present on the October 18 occasion. Accordingly, on October 25 Morin was again interviewed and told them that on October 18, about 5 p in , Menard came up and engaged Boucher in a conversation. He testified, "I could not hear the conversation word for word but from what I did hear I know that Menard was talking to Boucher about the Union. I heard him asking Boucher about his job code and hourly rate and say something about what the Union could do for him to help him. The conversation went on along these lines for 2 or 3 minutes and then I heard John Boucher tell Menard something to the effect that when he felt like joining the Union he would do so on his own " Massett testified that this statement by Morin corroborated that of Boucher It appears to me that it does nothing of the sort. On the contrary, it appears to reveal a serious discrepancy. Boucher did not testify to any such statements in the October 18 conversation nor did he tell Vardon and Massett that there had been any 'Connolly's title is apparently Supervisor of Internal Security Investigation Division of the Plant Protection Department of Pratt & Whitney Aircraft This is taken from the statement written by the investigators and signed by Boucher UNITED AIRCRAFT CORP. 943 such statements in that conversation . Comparing Boucher ' s testimony with the version contained in his statement of October 19 to Massett and Vardon further discrepancies appear . On the witness stand Boucher first stated that on October 25, when he first went to work in the department , Menard came to him and asked him to join the Union and he answered , "If I do join the Union I will do it on my own time." He then testified that a few days later Menard asked him to join the Union and told him that he could be a union steward if he did so because he would be the first man in his department. After showing him his October 19 statement (which Respondent 's counsel characterized as his October 18 statement ), Boucher testified that the first conversation he recalled took place on September 16 and he further testified that it was his first day at the Middletown plant and that it was Menard's first day at the Middletown plant. Later he testified that at that time Menard was not a shop steward, which accords with Menard's testimony and with the security investigative report which revealed that Menard was not appointed shop steward until September 28 and the appointment did not become effective until October 15. After Respondent's counsel again refreshed Boucher from his statement , Boucher testified that he had a conversation on October 18 at which Morin was present at which Menard "asked me if I would join the Union now. If I would I would have a good chance of being union steward in my department," to which he answered, "I told him if I joined the Union I'd do it on my own, not on company time." He next testified that he could have had a conversation similar to this one in September with Menard and finally, asked not whether it could have been, but whether there was such a conversation, he gave the following answer: That when he came up to me and asked if I joined the Union and then before.October 18, there, he come over to my machine and he asked me, that when Mr. Morin was with me over there and he asked me if I would leave, take a piece of paper, leave my name, clock number and my labor grade, also my home address so that he could have it, so I asked him the reason why so he told me said so that we'll send it to the Union so I can receive a card, a union card, either I carry in my wallet or my tool box, and I asked him why he said to see if you are making the proper wages, you're underrated or not. After what can only be characterized as further urging by counsel, Boucher testified that before Menard walked away, he said to Menard, "I told him I join the Union on my own time, it was wrong to talk business on company time." In the statement that Boucher gave Vardon and Massett he stated that on the first day that Menard talked to him Menard told him that the union dues were $5 to join and a $1.25 a week and "he also said that he didn't care who joined, as long as he got their $5 he didn't care any more." I consider that Boucher's testimony is worthy of little if any credit. It appears to me that the statement he first gave Massett and Vardon with regard to the October 18 incident, which revealed that the incident dealt only with Menard's effort to get his name, address, and clock number was probably the only credible statement that appears. His statement in the same document concerning Menard's solicitation to him on September 26, which in his testimony on the witness stand became September 16, is incredible in that it does not appear in anyway likely that Menard would have said that he didn't care who joined as long as he got their $5 at a time prior to his becoming shop steward since he would have not gotten their $5 unless and until he became shop steward. Boucher's testimony upon cross-examination that Menard was not a shop steward on that occasion is curiously at odds with the statement that he attributes to Menard. Even more curious is the alleged corroboration to Boucher's statement to be found in the second statement of Guyette taken a week later since Guyette "corroborated" to the satisfaction of the investigators information that they did not have and that first appeared, as far as anything on the record in this proceeding reveals, at the time Boucher was on the witness stand. It appears to me that Guyette's first statement is partially credible, his second is certainly not, nor is his testimony at the hearing. We can only conjecture as to the reasons why Guyette gave the second statement to the security investigators. It is clear that after the first round of investigation there was no evidence that Menard was guilty of soliciting for the Union as Karlon had charged. Accordingly, Karlon's statement was taken and he stood by his charge. Then, fortuitously, it came to Karlon's attention that Boucher had been approached by Menard and accordingly Boucher was brought to the security investigating department. Boucher's account of the October 18 conversation was no help to support Karlon's position. Yet, Boucher makes the conclusionary statement, after he recounted it, that "this is at least the fifth or sixth time that this man has approached me in the shop during working hours concerning joining the union." (Emphasis supplied.) What led to his recounting of the alleged conversation on the first day of his employment, which was palpably false, is not shown. Not until he signed his statement on October 19 was any information in the hands of the security investigators that Menard might have broken the rules I have no doubt that Menard did in fact contact 35 or 40 employees and asked them to join the Union as he revealed, and there can be little doubt that at least some of them might have been contacted on his or their working time, at least to the extent of asking them during a conversation whether they were interested in joining the Union There is no evidence that any contact other than that was made during working hours. On the other hand, the investigative file upon which allegedly the Respondent's decision to discharge Menard was made is clearly full of inconsistencies so that no person experienced in investigating or in reviewing results of an investigation could conclude that any sort of a case may be made out. Vardon, who was the agent in charge of the investigation, testified to over 23 years of investigative experience. Massett, who assisted Vardon, had 13 years of investigative experience, according to his testimony. Presumably their supervisor, Connolly, had some experience It is inconceivable to me that they could have reached the conclusion recited in their investigative report on the evidence that came to them especially in view of the way the evidence came to them. I am convinced that the "investigation" conducted by Respondent was undertaken solely for the purpose of making a paper record adequate in the opinion of Respondent to substantiate the discharge of an active and successful shop steward. It was initiated by a false statement from Karlon and supported by a false statement from Boucher who demonstrated his bias very plainly in his initial statement. I conclude that whether or not Menard was guilty of soliciting for the Union on company 944 DECISIONS OF NATIONAL LABOR RELATIONS BOARD time, his discharge' was consummated for the purpose of discouraging other shop stewards and employees in their union activities in violation of Section 8(a)(3) and (1) of the Act. 2. Clifford Nelson Clifford Nelson was a maintenance electrician, one of a group of seven or eight who worked together. In the normal course of their activities they worked all over the several plants of Pratt & Whitney installing electrical apparatus, wiring new departments, and the like. Each man had a small wagon with his tools, equipment, and supplies. Nelson was also the union steward in his section.1° Nelson was an industrious and effective organizer for the Union and, possibly as a result of his activities, most of the employees in his section were members. Walter Lancelot was employed in the same section as Clifford Nelson doing the same type of work. Lancelot had been employed by the State government on a road maintenance crew before he came to work for Respondent and wanted to return there. In December 1966 he arranged to return there after his wife, who was pregnant, was delivered, as he did not want to risk losing the insurance benefits that were connected with his employment at Respondent 's plant. In March , having ascertained that a job was available to him in the State road department, Lancelot quit his employment with Respondent. On March 15 he wrote three copies of a letter, one of which he gave to the general foreman , one to his foreman, and one to the personnel office. The letter stated: To Whom It May Concern: I, Walter Lancelot, will be terminating the 26th of March for the following reasons. I feel I cannot get ahead because I did not join the union , nor did I fit in the clique that is in our crew. I do not approve of favoritism. /s/ Walter Lancelot A personnel advisor, Mabey, interviewed Lancelot who told him that he thought that he had been discriminated against in the assignment of work because he had not joined the Union and complained that he had been solicited by Clifford Nelson during working hours on "at least five or six different occasions and had given him a union membership application card." He recited an incident which happened during the summer in the toolcrib in the "J Building" when Nelson asked him to join the Union and he refused td do so, whereupon Nelson referred to him as being cheap and no good. Later the same day he and Nelson almost got into a fight. He referred to another incident in October 1966, when Nelson 'Respondent 's contention . that Menard was not discharged but in fact quit is scarcely worthy of note. Menard on being told that he was discharged was told that to make his record look better it would be put down as a quit . The discharge becomes no less a discharge by the Employer's-falsification of the personnel papers "The company recognizes shop stewards in the handling of grievances and pays them up to 2 hours a week for this purpose. There is an additional class of steward known as union stewards who are not recognized by the Employer in handling grievances or any other respect. Their function is to form a liaison between the men in their departments or sections and the shop steward, to help organize , to pass information out to the employees, and to assist the shop steward in other ways While shop stewards are distinquished by red shirts with IAM insignia on them and a red border on their identification badge, union stewards wear blue shirts with IAM insignia and a blue border on their identification badge. asked him to join the Union while they were in department 661 and he recited an instance, about the first of March 1967, when Nelson had asked another mechanic, whom he identified as Brian Kelley, to join the Union In each instance Lancelot mentioned the name of other members of the crew who were present when the alleged infractions took place. Kelley testified that he was called to the internal security office and questioned by two men who told him they were investigating a complaint signed by an employee and asked him whether he had ever been asked to join the Union. Kelley said that he had been asked by a fellow employee whom he named as Hardie. The investigators showed him pictures and asked him to point out the man and he identified Nelson He told them that Nelson had approached him in department 661 during the lunch hour. Both men kept asking him whether it was during working time. He testified, " I kept trying to tell them that it happened during the lunch hour, but it seems to me they wanted to say that it happened while we were working in 661. They kept putting the words while we were working in there." They asked him about Lancelot and he told them that Lancelot had worked for him as a helper for about 3 days. They asked him what kind of a man Lancelot was and he told them that Lancelot was a "goof-off." When the interview was completed, they dictated a memorandum for his signature and he pointed out that the dictator didn't mention the fact that he had said that they were washed up and on their way to chow, but said that this happened while they were working. The investigator said, "We'll get it typed, and if you want to make any changes then we can make them." When the typed copy was brought back, Kelley testified, the same statement was in it and he mentioned it again, whereupon the investigator said, "well we'll put a circle around it" and he drew a red circle and said, "we'll have it taken out." Kelley testified that he initialed the place which they had circled and then signed the document on the second sheet, trusting that the investigators would take out the words to which he took exception. He had not seen the statement again until it was produced at the hearing. The statement itself stated in pertinent part: "Nelson asked me if I was interested in joining the Union and he talked to me about it for 5 minutes. While we were talking Nelson gave me two cards, a union application card and a union dues checkoff card and told me how to fill them out. I took the cards from Nelson and told him I'd have to think about it for a while. I don't recall what time of day this took place, except that it was while we were in department 661." In the paragraph preceding the above quotation, the following sentence appears: "About a month ago, while I was working with other members of my department on a plating job in department 661 . etc." In the paragraph after the quote, is the following sentence: "About 3 days after I had been given the cards Nelson came up to me while I was standing by the work cart of Bill Hardie in department 661, we were still working on the same job in that department, and he asked me if I had made up my mind yet about the Union and if I had signed the cards." Strikeovers and deletions are initialed. Kelley testified that he did not know Nelson personally, that he no longer worked for the Respondent and that he never joined the Union. He stated that Nelson never spoke to him about joining the Union other than on the two occasions, one the day the cards were given to him UNITED AIRCRAFT CORP. 945 and the other 3 days later .when Nelson asked for the return of the cards. He further testified that neither of these occasions took place during working hours. In the one case they had quit and were on their way to lunch, and the other case was near the end of the lunch period when the men were standing around waiting until it was time to go to work. The security investigators, Massett and Dobbins, next interviewed Robert Herring, who told them that in March of 1967, in department 661, while they were putting the tools away, getting ready to leave for lunch, he was locking his cart and he saw Kelley with a union card in his hand. He went to lunch with Kelley, and Kelley told him that Nelson had given the union cards to him and had asked him to join,the Union. Kelley told him that this had happened just before lunch. Herring's statement given the investigators goes on in the following fashion: "About three days later while we were still working in Department 661, Kelly and I were over by the work carts when Nelson came up and asked Kelly if he had made up his mind yet about joining the Union and if he had signed the cards. Kelly just told Nelson that he hadn't made up his mind yet and that he thought he had lost the cards somewhere." Herring testified that he told the investigators that both of these incidents took place during the lunch hour and that they were closing their trucks up to go to lunch. Massett's investigation report indicates that Massett considered that this was a substantiation of Lancelot's allegations. In the same report Massett reported that Kelley had confirmed Lancelot's allegations that Kelley had been solicited for the Union during working hours. The investigators next interviewed William Hardie, who told them that the incident in department 661 took place while the men were standing around the working carts in the department. He did not recall anything other than a conversation "about union activities," and he recalled that this took place about 3:15 p.m. He stated, "I don't recall this as having taken place before lunch." Hardie's statement too was reported as a corroboration of Lancelot 's allegations and of Kelley's alleged corroboration of Lancelot 's allegations. Respondent produced a witness , Robert Pogg , who had been a union steward in the same section with Nelson and Lancelot. Pogg testified that he was a friend of Lancelot and was no longer employed at Respondent's plant. Pogg testified that he was present at the incident in J crib and generally corroborated Lancelot's story. He placed the original solicitation around 10 to 10:30 in the morning, stated that Hardie and Don Soucier were present and stated that Nelson called Lancelot a cheap . He testified that latei that day after they had washed up, about a quarter to 12, they were standing outside the crib and Lancelot and Nelson had another discussion , during the course of which Nelson called Lancelot a vile name, whereupon he remonstrated with Nelson that this was not the way to convince Lancelot to join the Union and that if he kept it up Lancelot was going to hit him. He placed Soucier , Hardie, Nelson, and Herring as well as Casey and Lancelot at the scene. He also testified about Nelson handing cards to an unidentified employee during a coffeebreak in the morning at another time. Nelson 's version of the J Building incident is as follows: Well, we were, this here was I believe over in J Building , this was at the timeclock there and we were waiting to go back to work, we were still on lunch hour , it was five or ten minutes before we were quitting to go back to work, and I asked him, "Have you made up your mind yet about joining?" He said, "Why the hell should I join the union , they are no good and I get the same benefits, why should I pay the five dollars a month for dues?" and he said nasty remarks about the union , and I said, "You're probably too cheap to join anyway." then he started to come out with some real nasty stuff then. . . He said he would kick my fat right then. . . . I said, "I don't think you could." With regard to the investigation Nelson testified that he was told by his supervisor to go to the security department and knowing that the security department had already interrogated a number of his fellow workers, he suspected that "the Company was out to get me because I was a union steward " He asked his foreman for permission to take a shop steward with him. The foreman made a telephone call and told him that it was not permitted He went to internal security where he was interrogated by Massett and Montgomery. He asked them if he could have a shop steward and the answer was, "the only one that can answer the questions are you, the shop steward can't help you, and that it didn't have anything to do with the union, they were just trying to find out whether I fractured any company rules." They asked him about the incidents with Lancelot and Kelley, and wrote up a statement for his signature When they gave it to him to sign he said that he had no intention of signing it, that he wanted to take a copy and show it to Attorney Ratner. They refused to let him do so, and he refused to sign it. His interrogation lasted about 2 hours. On May 10 the general foreman came to Nelson and said, "Due to the investigation here, you have a choice of either being fired or quitting. If you quit we'll put down on the paper that you left for a better job or something, it would look better. I suggest that you do that. Either way you're going to go Get all your tools together and come with me." Nelson testified that because he feared that he would be blackballed if he was fired, he opted to quit, and his records so show." Nelson testified that he was well aware of the rules about soliciting on company time and took care not to do so and I believe that within his definition of the terms he was not guilty of the violation with which he was charged The incidents which the investigation revealed all took place while the men had broken for coffee, were at lunch, or coming and going from lunch. The record is clear that the maintenance electricians, when they are working at a spot distant from their own timeclock, are not required to clock out for lunch. It appears that they break a few minutes before the lunch period begins, lock up their tools and wash up, and then take their lunch, usually together. The incident with Lancelot at J Building, according to the testimony of Kelley, which I credit, commenced in the morning during a coffeebreak12 and the further incident, in which the argument became somewhat bitter, took place when they had broken for lunch but before they proceeded to the lunchroom. Similarly the incident with regard to Kelley took place after they had washed up and before they proceeded to the lunchroom It may very well be that the lunch period in either case had not actually commenced but it is clear that the employees were no longer at work when the incidents occurred Respondent contends that Nelson was "picking on" Lancelot because he would not join the Union. There is "Again I reject Respondent 's contention that Nelson was not discharged but quit It was at least a constructive discharge "The Company has no formal coffeebreak period, however it is clear that employees normally break for a few minutes in the morning between 10 and 10.30 and have a cup of coffee together. 946 DECISIONS OF NATIONAL LABOR RELATIONS BOARD some evidence in the record that ill feeling between Lancelot and Nelson preceded the union disucssion. At any rate I find that when Nelson asked Lancelot to join, Lancelot in fact went further than merely stating that he would not do so, as he testified, but in fact stung Nelson with the rejoinder that he didn't have to join the Union and pay dues because he would get any benefits accruing from the Union's contract without a fee I have no doubt that Nelson referred to him as cheap and probably used the language attributed to him in commenting to other employees about Nelson in Nelson's presence. On the other hand, it is clear that Nelson's harsh language to Lancelot was not the reason for his discharge The narrow legal issue in connection with Nelson's discharge is whether the no-solicitation rule and contractual provision was properly applied to the situation I believe that the investigators deliberately created ambiguous statements and relied on the ambiguity to attempt to avoid raising this issue Their report makes it appear that the employees were in fact at work when the solicitation took place That Massett must have recognized the implicit ambiguities appears equally clear to me. He is an experienced investigator and in a similar situation a few months earlier with regard to Menard he in fact went back and took a second affidavit to clear up an almost identical ambiguity The accounts of the employees interviewed, and particularly of Kelley, confirmed my opinion in this regard. Even Massett's testimony with regard to the changes made in Kelley's statement confirmed that Kelley insisted that the affidavit be changed to reflect the fact that Kelley did not state that they were at work when the incidents took place. It is noteworthy that the main thrust of Lancelot's letter which gave rise to the investigation concerned discri-nination in the assignment of work but no investigation whatsoever was made of that allegation. It was only after Lancelot was interviewed and the personnel advisor, George Mabey, reported that there had been solicitation during working hours that an investigation ensued and it is clear from the multiple reports submitted by the investigators that the investigation was closely followed and directed by the personnel department and especially by Joseph Regan, staff assistant to the personnel manager. Regan even went so far as to insist on the order of interviews. This is interesting information in light of the general denials by each of the investigators that the personnel department had any authority to direct them in their investigations I do not accept the impression that I believe they were trying to give that the investigation division is a semiautonomous section which deals with Personnel only through upper echelons of supervision and accepts no direction from the personnel department As in the case of Menard, from the record as a whole, I conclude that the investigation was undertaken and was conducted for the sole purpose of garnering enough evidence to support the discharge of an effective union steward and the mere fact that the evidence garnered during the investigation was ambiguous and, in the case of Lancelot, clearly biased was deliberately overlooked The fact that the investigators deliberately wrote misleading statements can afford Respondent no immunity in this regard. The investigators were clearly acting within the ambit of their agency and reporting closely both to Connolly, their supervisor, and to Regan in the personnel department as their investigation proceeded. I see no reason to believe that they did not report honestly in their verbal reports to these two men but in any event their action within the scope of their agency is attributable to Respondent. I also hold that the application of the no-solicitation rules relied on by Respondent is invalid. The only justification for a no-solicitation rule is that the employer has a right to expect his employees to work during working hours. The solicitations that took place here were conducted during the periods that employees broke to drink coffee and broke early to wash up for lunch. The coffeebreaks and washup periods are not formalized in the contract but are normally granted at the discretion of the foreman. Such times were characterized by Personnel Director Morse as well known exceptions to the rule against loafing. It is clear that these are not working hours and employees were in fact permitted to talk about any matter that they wanted to talk about, personal or otherwise, other than the Union." The application of the rule in this case was not in any way designed to protect the employer from any alleged loss of employees' working time; rather it was to inhibit the solicitation of the employees to join the Union and to dispose of a union steward who had been successful in soliciting employees for that purpose. I find that the discharge of Nelson is violative within the meaning of Section 8(a)( 3) and Q) of the Act. 3. Nicholas D'Andrea Nicholas D'Andrea, a stock chaser on the first shift at Pratt & Whitney , Southington , joined the Union in April 1967 and was appointed union steward at the first union meeting he attended His first act was to file a grievance that a foreman , Mason , ws assigning overtime unfairly. As a result of the grievance a number of employees, who had theretofore been getting excessive overtime lost this advantage . They determined to retaliate against D'Andrea, whom they blamed , by reporting that he was engaged in union activity in violation of the rules. Their leader, Bryda, who had been the union steward before D'Andrea's appointment , led off by "reporting" to Mason that D ' Andrea had pressured employees to join the Union, refused to cooperate with nonunion employees, and called them scabs. Mason turned over the matter to internal security, adding the allegation that D ' Andrea also was soliciting employees during working hours.' The investigators made a sweeping investigation during the course of which they took statements from Bryda (who knew only hearsay ), Swett , Licnikas, Meyer , Crosby, Dodge, and Valliere, all employees who had lost overtime as a result of the grievance. They also interviewed one Cosineaux. Each of the above-named employees except Crosby and Cosineaux were so incredible, their testimony contradicted the stories they told the investigators and they contradicted each other, and each was so plainly motivated by the vendetta they had undertaken to retaliate against D ' Andrea because of the overtime grievance, that I discredit them entirely. Cosineaux , however , related two incidents in which he was asked by D'Andrea , while he was at work , to join the "See Plasticoid Company,168 NLRB No 26 (TXD) "From the fact that Mason had no support for this allegation, it appears that Mason was either involved in the plot with Bryda or had his own grudge against D'Andrea Mason was the foreman responsible for the overtime grievance and had been the recipient of a gift of money collected by an employee, Dodge, one of the employees favored by the overtime assignments UNITED AIRCRAFT CORP. Union. D'Andrea did not deny either incident. While Cosineaux gave some fairly incredible testimony, the fact that these incidents were not denied gives them credence. Ralph Crosby testified, consistently with his statement to the investigators, that D'Andrea came up to him while he was working in the shipping well and asked him to join the Union. He answered that he was not interested, and D'Andrea did not push him any further He was not cross-examined, and his testimony was not controverted. I credit him. I have concluded that D'Andrea did solicit employees to join the Union during his and/or their working time. Under the terms of the contract between the Charging Parties and the Employer, solicitation was forbidden and there can be no question that D'Andrea knew it, for he so admitted. Thus, while most of the evidence adduced by Respondent at the hearing and adduced by the security investigators in their investigation was false, the single instance that Crosby related is ample to warrant D'Andrea's dismissal under the terms of the contract. General Counsel contends that the no-solicitation rule of Respondent was invalid because its application by Respondent was discriminatory. He adduced much evidence that solicitation on behalf of various charitable enterprises and other matters was constantly being undertaken at Respondent's plant. While some of Respondent' s witnesses denied that this was in fact true, both Licnikas and Dodge testified that there were employee solicitations during working time and it is quite clear on the evidence of various employees that not all of these solicitations were authorized by Respondent's higher levels of supervision, as leadman Sullivan testified, or were conducted during nonworking time. If we were faced only with a no-solicitation rule such as is found in the employee handbook, the General Counsel's position might be well taken. However, there is an additional element which must here be considered. Each of the contracts between the Charging Parties and the Employer have contained language similar to this: "There shall be no solicitation of employees for union membership or dues conducted upon the premises of the Company during working hours by the Union, its representatives or by employees." Ordinarily an employer's rights to reserve work time for work are not augmented by such a contractual prohibition," to the extent that the contractual provision above quoted exceeds the permissible scope of a no-solicitation rule unilaterally imposed by the employers. It is within the authority of an incumbent union to agree to such restriction on its own behalf (although it may not deprive employees of their rights to solicit or distribute literature during nonworking time in opposition to the incumbent union). Where a no-solicitation rule by the employer may not be enforced against solicitation on behalf of the union because such enforcement would be discriminatory, in view of the employer's failure to enforce the rule with regard to other types of solicitation, I believe that the contractual provision has the effect of reestablishing the rule solely with regard to solicitation on behalf of the Union. Here there can be no question that at least so far as D'Andrea's solicitation of Crosby is concerned he violated the contractual provision. There is no question but that the Employer vigorously enforced this contractual provision, even, as I have found above, to the extent of discrimination. It is clear from the record that this vigorous enforcement has proceeded over the years since the contractual provision was first adopted. I find that the discharge16 was a valid exercise of the contractual provision and is not violative of Section 947 8(a)(3) or (1) of the Act For the foregoing reasons I shall recommend that the complaint be dismissed insofar as it alleges the discharge of D'Andrea to be violative of the Act." 4. John W. Tardiff John Tardiff was employed on the second shift at the Pratt & Whitney Middletown plant as a machine operator In November 1967 he was a shop steward for Lodge 700 and a committeeman in that lodge. Respondent's employees are regularly rated by their supervision on their work and other attributes. The ratings given, known as merit ratings, are apparently used in consideration of employees for promotion or transfer from one grade to another. If the employee wishes to know his rating he may ask his foreman, who will supply it to him in the form of a five letter code. It appears that the numerical equivalents of the code are known only to supervision. The Union is supplied with the merit ratings of the employees in the unit in letter form. The union officers have the numerical equivalents and, as a service to the employees in the unit, furnish the employees with their ratings both in letter and number form. During his first month as shop steward, Tardiff received ratings for some or all of the employees in his department. He wrote the ratings on 3 by 5 inch slips of paper along with the employee's name and handed them out to the employees concerned, both on his worktime and on his nonwork time On November 20 Tardiff was interviewed in the internal security office by Internal Security Officer Vardon and Personnel Supervisor Lee who told him that they had a signed sworn statement that he gave employees a merit rating between 11:25 and 11.55, and asked him if he had passed out merit ratings in the past. He acknowledged that he had done so, but said that to his knowledge he had not passed them out on company time. He asked for a shop steward to be present during his interview and he was refused After rephrasing their question a number of different ways, and getting the same answer from Tardiff, Vardon dictated a statement to be signed by Tardiff which states in pertinent part: I have been Committeeman representing the Union in Bldg 150 for approximately one month. During this period I have provided to an undetermined number of employees merit rating information I provided this information to an undetermined number of employees while the employee and I were on our supper hour or prior to the beginning of our respective shifts. I deny that I have provided merit rating information to any employees while either that employee or myself were on company time. Vardon asked Tardiff to sign the statement and Tardiff refused to do so, whereupon he was released to go back to his machine. A week later, on November 27, Foremen Burk and Ingras told Tardiff that he was suspended for 3 days for the violation of company rules. Tardiff protested that he had not violated company rules and left the plant. "Glenn Berry Manufacturers , Inc, 169 NLRB No 121. "Again there is no question that D'Andrea was discharged Although, like Nelson, he was given an opportunity to resign rather than be discharged, he declined to do so "Gale Products , Division of Outboard Marine Corp , 142 NLRB 1246, enforcement denied 337 F 2d 390 (C A 7), Armco Steel Corporation, 148 NLRB 1179, enforcement denied 344 F 2d 621 (C A. 6), General Motors Corporation. 158 NLRB 1723, Glenn Berry Manufacturers , Inc, supra 948 DECISIONS OF NATIONAL LABOR RELATIONS BOARD Tardiff testified that during the 18-month period he had been working at this plant since 1966, he recalled at least five collections that had been taken up in his department, four of which were taken on company time. He testified that the foreman knew of the collections because he had seen them, had donated on occasion, and on one occasion when he donated asked that his name not be put down as a donor. On the witness stand Tardiff testified that he recalled giving some merit ratings during working hours, specifically one to Walter Mank, and that his recollection had been refreshed after the interview with the security investigators when he was relieved as shop steward and had read and destroyed certain notes that he had made at the time he was handing out the merit ratings. On cross-examination Tardiff testified that he knew that he was not supposed to conduct union business on company time, and that he had been so informed by the Union's agents to avoid complications and to avoid trouble When he was asked what kind of trouble, he answered "Such as me being suspended for 3 days." Respondent did not supply any evidence with regard to Tardiff's layoff other than to supply a file which was stipulated to be the investigative file with regard to Tardiff's disciplinary layoff. The investigative file bears a face sheet which states that the classification of the report is "employee delinquency - irregularities (conducting union business on company time)." The file contains four statements, one from Group Supervisor Gamble, who stated that Mank complained that Tardiff had given him a copy of his merit rating and he thought it was an invasion of privileged information that Tardiff was able to get such information. Gamble immediately advised General Foreman Forrest of this conversation. The second statement was that of Forrest, who stated that Group Supervisor Gamble advised him that Mank had been provided with his merit rating by Tardiff prior to the completion of his shift, whereupon Forrest at 1 in the morning discussed the situation with Mank, who told him that shortly before the start of the third shift Tardiff had provided him with a copy of his merit rating. It would thus appear that Tardiff was on duty at the time he provided Mank with the merit rating. At 5:40 in the morning Forrest obtained the telephone number of Personnel Supervisor Lee, whom he then called. Lee advised him that he would be in contact with him prior to the completion of the shift The statement of Mank reveals that between 11:52 and 11:55 p.m. Tardiff handed him a slip of paper and stated, " Here is your rating for the last rating period." Tardiff went on to say that he was getting more of the ratings as they became available and Mank's was one of the highest ratings that he had seen, and stated, "you only need seven more points for a raise."ts The fourth statement was that of Arthur Collins stating that Tardiff at 3:25 p.m. handed Collins a slip of paper. Collins said, "What is this?" Tardiff replied, "this is your merit rating." Collins said that he was en route to the timeclock when Tardiff handed him the slip of paper. He turned the slip of paper over to his foreman who had seen Tardiff hand it to him and asked what it was. He then proceeded to the timeclock and clocked out. In the absence of any evidence from Respondent, I presume that Tardiff was laid off for 3 days in punishment for his activities with regard to Collins and Mank in handing them their merit ratings. I suppose "Mank had already received training as a group supervisor and was apparently on the verge of being appointed to that position Tardiff's actions could be deemed union business. What precise rule he is alleged to have breached by his actions is impossible to say. There is no rule as such against conducting union business on company time or any other time. The no-solicitation provision in the contract deals only with soliciting union membership or union dues, and obviously he was guilty of neither. While in the two instances one or the other of the employees was "on the clock," it is apparent that both took place during the change of shift and the record is replete with evidence that employees are permitted to cease work early in order to wash up and get to the timeclock. In fact Collins was en route to the timeclock when he was handed the slip of paper by Tardiff. Respondent stipulated that the employees are not forbidden to talk during working hours and it is clear from the evidence that as long as their work is not substantially interfered with, considerable latitude is given the employees with regard to their personal communications. It is completely clear that Tardiff was laid off only because he was a shop steward engaged in an activity on behalf of the Union which could enhance the Union's position vis-a-vis the employees. Whatever rule was applied in Tardiff' s case was certainly applied discriminatorily.19 I have detailed the evidence with regard to the four alleged discriminatees to a far greater extent than ordinarily would be necessary for the reason that in addition to the 8(a)(3) allegations which I have dealt with, the General Counsel has alleged that Respondent committed various violations of Section 8(a)(1) and (5) by the actions taken in connection with the discrimination as well as by other acts and conduct which I shall consider below. I shall first consider the allegation that Respondent, by its security investigators, subjected shop and union stewards to coercive and excessive interrogations and investigations concerning their union activities under the color of enforcing Respondent's rule against union solicitation during working hours. In addition to the investigations with regard to Menard, Nelson, and D'Andrea, the General Counsel alleges incidents relating to stewards Buchans and Rooney. Lamar Buchans was a union steward in the spring of 1967. Near the end of April as he was coming into work, "Vardon, when he testified, although he was not asked about the Tardiff case , testified that the rule as he understands it is that "all union activites will be conducted on other than company time " When asked what rule he was referring to, he referred to rule 5 in the company book which prohibits gambling , taking orders, selling tickets, or soliciting money or other types of solicitation . At another point in his cross-examination he testified that there is a clause in the contract which stipulates under what circumstances union business can be conducted Foreman Carlin , testifiying about the Menard case on cross-examination , revealed that he believed that asking for information which would ultimately be given to the Union is solicitation within the meaning of the rule Perhaps the most engaging definition of the Employer's concept of solicitation is to be found in the testimony of Investigation Supervisor Connolly, who appears to have included in his definition, passing an obscene note, timecard irregularities, distribution of unauthorized literature ( i.e., a male employee passed a paper to a female employee with two words on it which had a sexual connotation), refusing service at the toolcrib, attempted seduction on the parking lot , harassment on the parking lot, use of company mail for personal business, a complaint of an interdepartmental reassignment with malice signed by an employee against his supervisor , extension of overtime breakperiod , misuse of a company vehicle , falsification of tool records, and gambling . Connolly, who testified with a minimum of candor and a maximum of equivocation, apparently conceives solicitation to include any circumstances in which one person speaks to another or may have spoken to another . Foreman Cochran, who was involved in an incident not yet related, testified that it is against the rule to talk about the Union or engage in activities of the Union during working hours UNITED AIRCRAFT CORP. 949 escorting a group of individuals who were not cleared by security but were assigned to work on some machinery in his department, he stopped at the gate to identify the persons he was escorting to the security guard. According to his story the guard seized him by the upper arm, jerked him to the side, and said that he was obstructing the flow of traffic. Buchans profanely, told the guard to take his hands off his arm and an argument ensued During the argument the guard noted that the picture of Buchans on his company badge did not match Buchans' appearance in that he had grown a mustache since the picture was taken The guard informed Buchans that he would have to have his badge changed and that he would not be allowed in the department again without • having it changed. Buchans proceeded to his foreman, George Johnson, whom he told of the incident. Johnson suggested that he get the guard's name and badge number. Buchans returned to the guard post where he asked the guard for his name and badge number. The guard. gave him the requested information and said, "I am apologizing to you in front of these witnesses." Buchans said that he would not accept the guard's apology. Buchans went back to his foreman and told him what had happened. The foreman said, "I think the guard has probably got the idea. He'll probably never grab anybody and jerk him around. I think you'd better drop it." Buchans agreed to do so. About 2 weeks later Buchans was called to the internal security office where he was interviewed by two agents, Clifford and Krieger, When he entered their office he was informed that the guard, Starzyk, had filed a formal complaint against him. He asked for a shop steward to be called and they denied his request stating that this was a matter involving the internal security of the plant, not covered under the contract and that he would not be given a shop steward. They read to him from a document which they stated was Starzyk's complaint and he asked them for a copy, which they refused. Buchans related the incident to Clifford and Krieger, as it is set forth above and answered questions regarding it. His statement was taken down in -longhand- and he was asked to sign it. He again asked for a shop steward and was denied. He refused to sign the statement because he was not given representation and asked if he could have a copy of the statement, stating that he would check with an attorney and if so advised would sign it. He was refused this request with the statement that if he did not sign it they would sign it for him.=He answered that he would not sign it and asked to call his foreman which was permitted. He telephoned his foreman and asked if it was legal for them to deny him a shop steward and a copy of the statement and Starzyk's complaint. The foreman suggested that it was legal and that he sign it, Buchan agreed to sign the statement if he could add his own statements to it and they permitted him to do so. Accordingly, he wrote on it that he was denied a shop steward and that he was denied a copy. He then signed it and left it with them. Several days later he was called back to the internal security office where he met the same men. As soon as he got there he again requested a shop steward and his request was denied. The security investigators told him that the statement that he had signed was too messy, and they had had it typed, and wanted him to sign it. He agreed to sign it if they gave him a copy or if they would let him show it to an attorney. One of the investigators left the room and came back with a third person who strongly informed Buchans that in internal security he was not entitled to representation of a shop steward or to a copy of anything that went on and that he should know it. The third man told the security investigators to read Buchans the statement and that if he still refused to sign it to call the man back and left the room. They read the statement to him The statement was similar to that which he had dictated the previous week but did not include the additions that he had made. Buchans refused to sign it and one of the investigators brought the third man back into the room. Buchans told him that he was under the impression that he was entitled to representation any time a charge was filed against him and the third man told him that he was not entitled, in that office, to representation, that this was not like being taken to a police station where you could demand a lawyer. He asked if Buchans still refused to sign the statement and Buchans said he would not sign it without representation, whereupon the third man told the security investigators to sign it for him and put it in the record One of the investigators said, "Why don't you think about it over night and if you decide to sign it between now and tomorrow give us a call." When Buchans returned to his department he asked for a shop steward and one was called. In response to the General Counsel's subpena Respondent supplied what purports to be an investigation file in Buchans' case. The file contains an unsigned typed statement purporting to be that of Buchans and a signed typed statement purporting to be that of Starzyk. Security Investigator Clifford was called by Respondent with regard to another matter but was at no time asked about the incident with Buchans. Starzyk was not called nor was Security Investigator Krieger. The third man in the second interrogation was not identified at any time. Buchans appeared credible and his testimony is uncontroverted. Accordingly, I accept his version of the events set forth above. The last incident considered by the General Counsel to support this allegation concerned Howard R. Rooney who was employed as an inspector and was a union steward in the East Hartford plant On or about June 23, 1967, Rooney had a conversation with Joyce Carroll who, according to his information, was about to quit her employment. Rooney testified that he went to Mrs. Carroll to say goodbye and to wish her luck. She told him that she had changed her mind about quitting and the two had a conversation about her reasons for remaining. During the course of the conversation she offered to give him back a copy of the contract in booklet form which he had theretofore supplied her. He told her to keep the contract because he had another copy. Shortly after the conversation with Carroll, Rooney's foreman, Cochran, came to him and asked him why he was talking to Carroll. Rooney said it was a personal matter and Cochran asked what he was doing with the union book. Rooney explained that it was his book and that she had offered to give it back and he told her to keep it because he had one. Cochran said, "Is that all?" Rooney said, "yes" whereupon Cochran said, "Mr. when you put that badge on you're on thin ice" and walked away Rooney watched Cochran and saw him go directly to Carroll. He put his hand out and said something, whereupon she opened her drawer and gave him the union contract 20 '*The contract was published in booklet form apparently by the Union, and distributed solely by the Union I can recall no place in the record in which any representative of Respondent referred to it as a contract. It is apparently spoken of only as the union book and it appears that the possession of a copy of the contract is deemed by the security department to be prima facie evidence that the possessor was either soliciting or had been solicited 950 DECISIONS OF NATIONAL LABOR RELATIONS BOARD The same evening, 2 hours later, Cochran told Rooney to go to the security office, which he did. He was met there by security investigators Clifford and McLaughlin who told him to come in and have a seat . Rooney asked for a shop steward and Clifford answered that he had no right to a shop steward because this was an internal security matter that had nothing to do with the Union. McLaughlin said that an incident had been reported about something that had happened in the department and asked Rooney to give his version of the incident. Rooney asked who reported the incident and McLaughlin said that the only thing they knew was that it had been reported and he had to investigate it. Rooney gave his version of the incident with Carroll. McLaughlin asked whether he was sure he did not try to solicit her into the Union which Rooney denied and McLaughlin asked again if Rooney's only purpose was to say goodbye which Rooney agreed to. Rooney told of his conversation with Cochran and complained of Cochran's statement that he was on thin ice. Clifford asked if he wanted that in his statement. Rooney said that he did because he was going to go to personnel about this. Clifford answered that this was a problem for personnel to handle. Rooney answered that he did not care whose problem it was, that Cochran had made the statement, and that he (Rooney) was going to complain about it. Rooney said he felt that he was being harassed by Cochran and that it was his opinion that was the only reason he had been called down to the security office. When his statement was completed Rooney was asked to sign it and he said he would ask the union lawyer and would sign it or not depending on what the Union's lawyer recommended to him. McLaughlin wrote on the statement that Rooney had refused to sign it. Rooney returned to his department." Rooney also testified that he had had a conversation with Cochran after he had gone to the personnel department without Cochran's permission and filed a grievance against Cochran. He had theretofore complained to Cochran that he had been denied transfers, on several occasions he had been denied a raise, and he had not received his rating and asked Cochran to provide him with a shop steward so he could fill out a grievance. Cochran said he didn't think he had a grievance to which Rooney replied, "I just as soon let the shop steward decide that." Cochran made a telephone call after which he told Rooney that he did not have a grievance. Rooney asked, "who's opinion is that, your's or the Company's?" Cochran answered, "That's the Company's and if anybody knows the company policy, I do " Foreman Cochran was called to testify. His testimony of the incident between Joyce Carroll and Rooney is generally corroborative of Rooney's account except that Cochran stated that the conversation between Carroll and Rooney lasted at least 10 minutes where Rooney stated it lasted only a few minutes. In his account of the confrontation with Rooney Cochran stated: I asked Mr. Rooney what he had been doing talking to Mrs. Carroll after the lunch period was completed, and he replied that he had heard that she was leaving and he had gone over to say good by to her. Then I asked him if it wasn't a fact that there was a union book on the table in front of them and he admitted that there was. So, I said what was the purpose of this. Well, he said, she was explaining to me and pointing out to me "At the end of July Rooney resigned from Respondent 's employ stating that his resignation was occasioned by Cochran' s continuing harassment. why she had changed her mind about leaving . I said, well, you were in fact talking about union activities. He gave a shrug of his shoulders and that was it . I remarked to him at the time that he was on rather "thin ice." Cochran went on to point out that he had various objections to Rooney as an employee. They appeared to boil down to an incident in which he had missed a gauge, the incident when he went to the personnel office and filed a grievance against Cochran without his permission, and an incident where Rooney questioned a leadman who had been sent to the crib to search for a tool. The crib had a sign on the door "authorized personnel only" and Rooney questioned the leadman 's authority to enter the crib and the authority of the foreman to authorize him to enter the crib. All of these incidents took place after Rooney became a shop steward. In cross-examination it developed that Cochran had called the personnel office before speaking to Rooney because it was "a very ticklish subject." Asked what was ticklish about two employees engaged in a conversation on company time he stated "the fact that there was a union book before them . if they were discussing the union book they were talking union affairs." Asked what he would have done if they would have had a magazine article rather than a union book before them he stated that he would not have called personnel because "I don't believe that this is a bad enough article or bad enough item to request any further information." Discussion The thrust of the General Counsel's allegation as contained in the paragraph is manifold. Both the investigation and the interrogations of the shop stewards are allegedly unlawfully coercive. The General Counsel defined his term excessive as follows. "The term excessive means unreasonably, defined in terms of the balance which the Board must maintain between the employer's legitimate investigation and enforcement of rules against solicitation of union membership on company time on the one hand and the employees' statutory interest in freedom to organize without unnecessary or discriminatory restraint on the other, evaluated in light of rational norms and the employer's practices and policies in investigation and enforcement of other rules governing employees' activity on company time, such as rules against loafing, distribution of unauthorized literature, visiting other departments without permission and loitering." It appears therefore that we are faced in a first instance with a subdivision of the allegation into "investigation" and "interrogation." I conceive that an investigation could be coercive in terms of the Act only if it were evident to employees that the investigation exceeds in scope the investigation normally conducted by the Employer with regard to breaches of the Employer's rules or contractual provisions unrelated to union activity. I do not believe that the General Counsel contends that an investigation as such into a potential breach of contract or breach of Employer's rules is violative. The Board and the courts have too often found the contrary. At least insofar as the allegation concerns investigations, it is only by a comparison with other investigations that the General Counsel's position can be tested. The General Counsel called for the production by Respondents of all files, records, memoranda, etc., maintained by Respondents for its East Hartford, Middletown, and Southington plants from January 1, UNITED AIRCRAFT CORP. 951 1966, to September 29, 1967,,. pertaining to each investigation undertaken by the internal security department during that period, as to violations or suspected violations of its no-solicitation rule, a rule against distribution of unauthorized literature, visiting other departments, and loitering. Pursuant to discussions between counsel and Trial Examiner's rulings on Respondents' request to, revoke, Respondents supplied some 60 files which Respondents contended were all the files involving violations of rules 5, 6, and 8 of the Employer's rule book, which in general are the rules against gambling and soliciting, distribution of unauthorized literature, and visiting other departments without permission or, interfering in any way with the work of others.7,2 The 60 files produced, together with the 6 files involved in the investigations set forth in the section above, according to the assertion of Respondents' counsel, constitute all of the files relating to the enforcement of those 3 rules. After using the files for the purpose of cross-examining Supervisor Connolly, the General Counsel made no move to introduce them in evidence. The Respondents however selected from the 60, 37 files which he introduced for the purpose of showing the nature of the investigation conducted in regard to violations other than those connected with union' activities of its employees. I have carefully considered each of these 37 files as well as the 6 files introduced by. the General Counsel and I other file introduced by the General 'Counsel for other purposes, dealing with the investigation of an offense characterized as "use of company mail for personal business," for purposes of comparing,, to the extent that I was able to do so through contents of the files, and nature and extent of the investigations taken. First, the General Counsel appears to contend that the investigations of union-oriented violations are somehow more stringently carried out, by the fact that it appears that each witness interviewed in such investigations was interviewed by two persons,. Credence was offered General Counsel's position by the evasive and sometimes false testimony of the various investigators called -to the witness stand that the invariable custom when interviewing an employee concerning a violation was to have two persons present. All of the investigation files concerning union-oriented violations revealed that statements were taken from employees in the presence of two interrogators. Of the 38 files otherwise produced 16 appear on their face to contain statements taken in the presence of only I investigator, 18 contain statements taken in the presence of 2 or 3 investigators (2 files contained both statements taken by 1 investigator and statements taken by 2 investigators), and 7 contained no statements at all. It does not appear therefore that the General Counsel's contention in this regard is supported by the evidence. From the standpoint of the completeness with which the allegations in the various files were investigated, I can see no significant difference between the files dealing with union-oriented offenses and those dealing with other offenses. In both cases it appears that witnesses were reinterviewed when their initial interviews disclosed t2The text of the rules is as follows : 5, gambling , taking orders, selling tickets, or soliciting money or any other type of solicitation 6, posting or distributing unauthorized pictures or literature 8, visiting other departments except in respect to assigned work, or with the expressed permission of the foreman or department head , or interfering in any way with the work of others. ambiguity or when later developed evidence indicated a need for reinterview and in both types of cases it appears that to some extent the personnel office was directly involved in the investigation23 to the extent of requesting the interview of certain witnesses and delaying the interviews of others. I cannot say that the record discloses that the security investigators engaged in any different type of investigation with regard to union-oriented violations than with regard to other types of violations. Nor, judging from the results of the investigations as indicated on both the investigation files and in an exhibit offered by Respondents to reveal the dispositions taken, is there any revealing difference between the 38 files produced by Respondents and those specifically alleged in the complaint Of them, 13 subjects resigned, 5 were dismissed and employees were suspended in 9 cases 24 In addition, in other cases, warnings both written and verbal were given and in seven cases no action was taken. It could be argued that General Counsel's contention is supported by the fact that in a plant with employees numbering in the tens of thousands the ratio of union-oriented investigations to other types of investigations is too high. However, with the exception of evidence that the no-solicitation rule, as distinguished from the contractual provision relating to solicitation for union membership, was honored more in the breach than in the observance, the General Counsel has not adduced evidence that in fact a higher ratio of investigations to violations of each type of rule infraction appears, other than the fact that there is copious evidence that employees were permitted to engage in conversation during working hours, and Investigator Vardon, who was the only investigator at the Middletown plant, had never investigated any employee for this alleged violation. In short, in no respect can I find that the investigations, as distinguished from the interrogations conducted during the course of the investigations, were conducted excessively or coercively and to the extent that the complaint so alleges, I shall recommend its dismissal. With regard to the interrogations conducted, a different series of considerations must be made. Here we must consider whether the individual interrogations were, in a sense, in vacuo, excessive and coercive, or whether in comparison they were so with interrogations conducted with respect to other rule violations. The General Counsel adduced no evidence that the method of interrogation by the security investigators differed in any way in the two types of cases. The purported statements appearing in the 35 investigative files which had no relationship to union activities26 give no clue to the type of interrogation indulged in by the security investigators in obtaining the files. Their content however, as compared with the content of the statements in the files offered by the General Counsel, is not so dissimilar in form or in substance that it could be said that they evidence a different type of interrogation. Accordingly, I find that the General Counsel has not sustained his burden of proof that, as compared to interrogation having to do with matters other than union activity, the interrogations complained of were coercive. "Again contrary to the assertions of the investigators on the witness stand "There is an overlap because in three cases, all involving gambling, one person was dismissed and others were given suspension of i week "Of the 44 files, 3 introduced by Respondent dealt with alleged union solicitation One of the seven files introduced by the General Counsel related to a violation which had nothing to do with the Union 952 DECISIONS OF NATIONAL LABOR RELATIONS BOARD Finally, with regard to the interrogations conducted by the security agents, which were fully reported on the witness stand in the instant proceeding, the General Counsel contends that under the decisions of the Board and the courts the interrogations were inherently coercive in themselves and without regard to the practice of the Employer in other investigations, or as he puts it "evaluated in the light of rational norms " This is no new concept to the Board It is true, as Respondents point out, that the right of employers to establish rules to govern the conduct of its employees on company time and premises is recognized to bear with it a concomitant right to investigate to determine whether such rules have been breached by the employees.36 As Trial Examiner Funke stated in Montgomery Ward & Co. (145 NLRB 846), "1 do not know how a company could enforce a no-solicitation rule unless it could make inquiry concerning reported violations and I do not know how inquiry could be made without interrogating the participants." But this right is not absolute because its exercise necessarily requires that the employer delve into the union activities of its employees. When the rules it is enforcing have to do with such activities it is necessary for some accommodation to be made between the employer's right to enforce its rules and the employees' right to engage in such activities without undue coercion or restraint from the employer. In the Montgomery Ward case the Board laid down two of the boundaries. First, the rule which is being enforced must be a valid rule as distinguished from a rule which is itself unlawful. Second, the purpose of the employer engaging in the interrogation must be made known to the employees questioned These are certainly reasonable restrictions In Pepsi-Cola Bottlers of Miami, Inc. (155 NLRB 527), the Board found the interrogation of an employee impermissible because it was carried out in support of an illegal no-solicitation rule. The Board further found it improper because the questioning occurred in the presence of a court reporter and against a background of demonstrated union animus by respondent Another apparent boundary was established in Springfield Garment Manufacturing Company (153 NLRB 1126), in which the Board found that persistent questioning of employees by the employer's attorney in the face of their refusal to volunteer information, under the circumstances of demonstrated union animus, constituted coercion. These interviews dealt with pretrial preparation by counsel rather than with the enforcement of rules of conduct by the employer. I can conceive of no rationale to distinguish between the two situations and I consider that the case is in point in the instant consideration. In Lexington Chair Company (150 NLRB 1328), the repetitive questioning of whether another employee had been "pressuring or bothering him about the Union," after receiving a negative answer, was found violative against a background of demonstrated union animus. In addition, the privilege of interrogation of employees concerning union activities accorded employers in both the situation of pretrail preparation and of enforcement of valid employer rules is limited to asking questions as relevant to the purposes of the inquiry as possible. Hence, in a situation where the interrogations have gone beyond the need for information into the concerted activities of either the interrogatee or fellow employees, the Board uniformly finds a violation.27 I must therefore consider whether the incidents of interrogation with which we are here dealing fall within the restrictions set forth in the above cases 1. The rule seeking to be enforced must be valid and lawful. 2 Interrogation must be conducted against a background free of union animus. 3. The employee must be informed of the purpose of the interrogation. 4. If the employee refuses to respond to the interrogation, it must not persist. 5. The questions asked must relate reasonably to the rule seeking to be invoked. Bearing these in mind we shall examine the interrogations here charged to be unlawful. 5. Menard Menard testified that he was called into the office of the security investigators where he was interviewed by two men from internal security and a secretary He testified that the men identified themselves, what their jobs were, and asked him if he knew why he was there. He answered that he figured that it had something to do with the Union They asked him repeatedly whether he admitted conducting union business during working hours and he told them that he might have but he might not have, he didn't know because there were two different lunch hours and he didn't know who was on lunch and who wasn't on lunch and he only asked people to join the Union when he was on his lunch. They asked him when did he join the Union and where and who the shop steward was. He told them that he joined in East Hartford, during the day, and that he couldn't recall the name of the shop steward. They identified a man and he told them that he remembered him as the shop steward but did not remember it was done during working hours. They told him that it was. They also asked if he had any personal problems and said that a lot of times people have personal problems and come to the security investigators and they try to help them out, whereupon Menard went over his personal problems and told them what they were. All the time they kept going back over and over again asking him whether he admitted conducting union business during working hours and he told them he did not admit it, that he may or may not have done so. They informed him that they had a couple of men planted in the department who "admitted" that he had come to them and conducted union business during working hours and that they had photographs proving that he was conducting union business during working hours. He asked to see the photographs but they said that they were not authorized to show them to him. They gave him the names of a few employees in the plant that he had supposedly solicited and asked him if he could recognize their names but he did not recognize them. They asked if he was going around collecting names and addresses; he said that he had. They asked him why and he told them that he didn't know. He told them that the Union asked, if it was possible, if he could get the names and addresses and he said that he would try, but he didn't ask why and he wasn't told In response to a leading question he recalled that they asked him if he was a member of the Union and "Star- Brice Industries , Inc., 127 NLRB 1008, Georgia-Pacific Corporation , 132 NLRB 612, Procter & Gamble Manufacturing Company, 160 NLRB 334 "Lindsay Newspapers, Inc, 130 NLRB 630, Guild Industries Manufacturing Corp , 133 NLRB 1719, Aladdin Industries , Inc, 147 NLRB 1392 UNITED AIRCRAFT CORP. asked when it was almost over if he had any intention of quitting the Union. He told them that he didn't know and they said that they had heard in the past of people who had quit the Union and the Company had taken it into consideration and these people were still working at Pratt & Whitney. He said he would think about quitting. Menard then said that they dictated the statement and the first thing they said was "I Kenneth R. Menard, admit conducting union business during working" and he told them that he did not admit that. When the statement had been typed they gave him a copy of it and said to initial any errors and read it to him. He stated that he was tired and scared and did not bother reading it. He just let them read it and when they pointed and said to sign, he signed it. He initialed it where they told him to initial it. He claimed he has never read the document. Investigator Vardon testified that he, together with Investigator Massett, interrogated Menard. He denied asking him during the interview if he admitted conducting union business during working hours. He denied asking him during the interview when he had joined the Union and testified that Menard volunteered that information. He denied asking Menard if he had any personal problems and testified that Menard brought that out voluntarily and expounded on it for quite some time. He denied telling Menard that he had a couple of men planted in the department who had told the investigators that Menard had been conducting business during working hours He denied telling him that there were photographs proving that he had been conducting union business during working hours, denied suggesting that other persons had quit the Union and the Company had taken this into consideration, and that those employees were still employees of Pratt & Whitney. He did testify on cross-examination that he did find time to ask Menard questions but at no point in his examination did he give an account of the interrogation nor say what questions he asked Menard.=' Investigator William Massett testified that he was assigned to assist Vardon in interviewing the witnesses in the Menard case , and that he was present during Menard's interview. He testified that after they identified themselves to Menard they asked him several identifying questions, explained the allegations that he had been conducting union business during working hours and asked him to tell them about it. At this point Menard told them that he had been assigned to and had been attempting to obtain the names and addresses of all the '1Vardon also denied even interviewing an employee, Raymond Desloges, with regard to the Menard case Desloges had been called by the General Counsel and' testified that he was called to the security office and interviewed by two men whom he could not identify, although he knew one of them by sight . Later in the hearing he identified Vardon as one of the security men who had interviewed him. He testified that Menard had solicited him on the parking lot to join the Union but that he had not done so, and that when he was called to the personnel office he was asked whether he had been approached to join the Union and by whom. He refused to give Menard' s name , stating he was a good friend, but said he was ,solicited by the shop steward . He told them that the only time Menard had approached him was on his lunch break , and that he was only approached two other times but just jokingly with a few members in the department On cross-examination he testified that they asked him whether anyone had asked him to join the Union during his working hours and asked if it was the steward in his department , who was Menard . He also testified that they asked whether anyone other than Menard had solicited him to join the Union and he answered no. He testified that no statement was taken. I credit Desloges but, except for an additional shadow on the credibility of Vardon, who denied interviewing Desloges, I see no relevance to his evidence 953 employees in the building in which he worked , and that he utilized his lunch period to try and take care of this assignment . He said that because the lunch periods were staggered he would often be talking to someone that was still at work , getting the information that the Union wanted . Menard also said that sometimes he used his own regular working time to talk to people concerning the Union. Menard said that he found the job more than he could handle , he said he was going to drop his stewardship , and eventually his union membership because the amount of dues he had to pay out was too much of a financial strain on him This Menard told them in confidence . Menard went on concerning his financial problems and told him about his personal problems at great length Menard told them that until Foreman Karlon had spoken to him about conducting union business during working hours he had no idea there was anything wrong with it and explained that while he was in the East Hartford plant he had been asked by the shop steward in his department to join the Union during working hours and had been signed up, paid dues, and given his pin and membership card all during working hours. Menard took a booklet out of his shirt pocket and showed it to them saying it was a copy of the union contract that he had just received the day before and had not yet read . The investigators asked Menard again who the shop steward was that signed him up and he said he preferred not to name him . They mentioned the names of several employees from his department including Guyette, Morin, and probably Boucher. Menard said he had talked to so many people that he could not remember any specific person . He testified that the entire interview took about 2-1/2 hours including the time spent waiting for the statement to be typed. When the statement was typed Menard went over it, appeared to be reading it, and signed and initialed it in the appropriate places. I do not completely credit any of the three accounts of the interview . From his attitude and his testimony on the witness stand I believe that Menard in his testimony sought to justify himself, sometimes at the expense of candor. Vardon and Massett both distingushed themselves in cross-examination in their evasiveness concerning their handling of this and other investigations and of their understanding of the rules in which they were involved in the enforcement . From the statement that Menard signed, from the affidavits which he thereafter signed , and from an amalgam of the testimony of the three witnesses to the interview , I believe that the investigators called Menard in, informed him that a number of employees had signed statements that he had conducted union business with them on company time, and asked him to explain himself. I believe that he told them in this regard substantially what Massett testified , i.e., that he had been instructed to get the names and addresses of the employees and that he had done so to the best of his ability, largely during his own lunchtime . I believe that he was interrogated repeatedly with regard to the various allegations that they had embodied in the statements signed by Guyette, Morin, and Boucher, the truth of which I have dealt with above, and that they accused him of committing each of the violations . I believe that the length of the interview together with the accusatory nature of it put him in fear of his job and that he sought to appeal to them by recounting his various personal troubles and by hinting that he was considering resigning from his stewardship and resigning from the Union . I believe that one or the other of the investigators , after they left the room and consulted together , suggested to him that it might go 954 DECISIONS OF NATIONAL LABOR RELATIONS BOARD easier for him if he did resign from the Union. Finally, I believe that Menard knew very well what he was signing and read the statement." Applying the rules set forth above to the interrogation of Menard, I conclude that the interrogation is unlawful within the meaning of Section 8(a)(1). The inquiry certainly was relevant but it was relevant to an invalid rule; i e , a rule against "conducting union business on Company time." Also, the antiunion background throughout this case is perfectly clear as I shall discuss elsewhere. 6. Nelson Clifford Nelson testified that he was called to the security office and interviewed by Officers Massett and Montgomery. They told him that they did not have to tell him what the interview was about because he probably knew, and advised him that they were taking notes. He asked for a shop steward and they answered that he could not have one and that the interrogation had nothing to do with the Union. Only Nelson could answer the questions, the shop steward could not help him and they were just trying to find out whether he "fractured" any company rules. Massett asked most of the questions. Nelson asked whether he could take notes and they gave him permission to do so. His notes included the questions they were asking and other things.30 They asked him if he knew Lancelot and whether he had ever pestered him about joining the Union on company time and he answered that he had not They asked whether he had an argument with Lancelot at J crib that almost ended in a fight, and he said no he did not. One of them asked, "are you sure that you never asked him to join the Union on company time?" He answered, "yes, I never asked anybody to loin the Union on company time because the Union said the only time we can solicit people is before seven, after work, or during lunch hours" They asked if he knew Bernard Kelley and he agreed that he did They asked if he had ever asked Kelley to join on company time and he said he had not. They told him they had sworn statements that he had asked those men to join on company time. He asked to see the statements and they refused to let him do so. He again said that he had never asked anyone to join the Union on company time. They asked again, "are you sure you didn't ask Kelley to join" and he answered yes. They asked him if he ever called Lancelot any names and he answered he had never used that particular language to him. They continued to ask him about asking these men to join on company time and he continued to deny having done so When the statement was typed he was given it, asked to read it, and sign it. Nelson said he had no intention of signing it, that he would take it and show it to Attorney Ratner and if he agreed that it was alright to sign it he would sign it They said that it was a perfectly legal statement and Ratner couldn't help him out, and assured him that it was alright to sign it, but Nelson answered that maybe Ratner could find some loopholes in it, changing the phrases and words around, and saying something that he didn't mean. So they took the papers "The General Counsel adduced a letter written by Menard the next day after his interview resigning as shop steward and union member and referring to his interview in the internal security division stating "What happened there shook me up so bad I had to take the rest of the night off I can't afford to go through this again and I can't afford to lose my job over this " After talking to a union representative, Menard decided to stay with the Union and attended a meeting the following Sunday in which he was elected to the contract negotiating committee and dismissed him. According to the statement which he did not sign, Nelson stated that he had asked Kelly to loin the Union at lunch and denied ever having given Lancelot a checkoff card. Otherwise the statement appears to follow pretty closely Nelson's testimony Montgomery was not called to testify. Massett testified that he interviewed Nelson together with Montgomery and his account of the interview is substantially the same as Nelson's except that he testified that the statement, when it was typed, was read to Nelson and he agreed that it was accurate but would not sign it until Ratner or another IAM official could look at it Again applying the rule that I have set forth above, it is quite apparent that, as I have found in considerat.on of Nelson's discharge, the investigation was carried out primarily in support of a rule against conducting union business on company time which rule was discriminatorily enforced and therefore unlawful. Accordingly, the interrogation is impermissible and violated Section 8(a)(1) of the Act." 7. D'Andrea The General Counsel contends that both interrogations of D'Andrea, those of May I I and 12, are violative of the Act D'Andrea testified that in the first interrogation conducted by investigators Crosson and Dobbins, Dobbins led off telling him that some of his fellow workers had registered complaints against him. He asked Dobbins for representation or a shop steward and Dobbins said that he could not have one. D'Andrea then asked if he might return to work and Dobbins said that he could not, that it was a reasonable request by management to get him to tell his side of the story concerning the charges that were registered against him by his fellow workers. D'Andrea said, "Well I am not sure what you are trying to get at. Are you trying to prod me into something?" Dobbins answered, "You mean that you don't know that three people have said you signed them up on company time?" Dobbins also said something about nine people having signed statements that D'Andrea solicited them on company time. D'Andrea testified that Dobbins raised his voice and "hollered" at him. He told Dobbins that he was getting nervous and asked him to lower his voice Dobbins accused D'Andrea of being very ambiguous and D'Andrea returned the favor. Then Dobbins asked whether D'Andrea had solicited on company time, refused to cooperate with workers, and told them that he would refuse to cooperate with them and called people "scab" and the likes. D'Andrea answered, "No, what you getting at')" Dobbins reminded him of the occasion in the J crib where he allegedly called Swett a scab. D'Andrea told them his version of the story and Dobbins said, "Do you mean you never gave Mr. Swett a union card to sign. Isn't it true that on such and such a date that you did hand Hazen Swett cards " D'Andrea answered that he recalled clearly that he gave Hazen Swett union cards in the credit union and recounted that conversation as well as an earlier conversation, and stated that in the conversation in the credit union Swett agreed to sign the card, whereupon, he gave cards to Swett. Dobbins then asked if it was not true that D'Andrea had solicited Valliere on company time even before he had completed his probation 33 "His notes were not produced at the hearing. "Pepsi-Cola Bottlers ofMiami, Inc, 155 NLRB 527 "Dobbins apparently was under the impression that there is something unlawful about asking an employee to join the Union before he completed UNITED AIRCRAFT CORP. 955 D'Andrea countered this question by telling how he signed up Valliere while they were eating lunch together in a storeroom . At this point , according to D'Andrea , Dobbins shouted to him again and he asked Dobbins if he could go get a drink of water . Dobbins agreed to let him do so and detailed Crosson to accompany him. He went to the water fountain in the hall and then went into a washroom to relieve himself. Crosson followed him into the washroom and D ' Andrea suggested to Crosson that he was following him around like a police dog. Crosson answered, "I thought you were running away." D'Andrea said he was not running away and accused Crosson of acting like a Fascist . Crosson then led him to the supervisor's lavatory and then back to the internal security office . When they returned to the security office, D'Andrea asked Dobbins why he had Crosson follow him and asked what they were trying to do to him . Crosson explained that he was just trying to show D ' Andrea where the other lavatory was and that he thought D'Andrea was running away. D'Andrea accused the investigators of trying to coerce him and they denied it . At this point Dobbins said he was going to lower his voice and ask him again to tell his side of the story concerning the complaints and agreed to put down whatever D'Andrea said. Dobbins was using a form sometimes used by the security office which comences as follows "I , Nicholas D'Andrea, of my own free will and without fear .. As soon as D'Andrea saw that he said, "Mr . Dobbins I am not here of my own free will and I am afraid because you people are scaring me." Dobbins attempted to reassure him and then reminded him that nine men had signed statements that he had solicited them on company time. D ' Andrea asked to see the statements and the investigative report but Dobbins refused to permit him to do so. D'Andrea complained that they were asking him to sign a report without letting him know what the charges were against him and said he would not sign any statement , whereupon Dobbins rejoined that D ' Andrea knew he was guilty, that they knew he was guilty, and that they were going to prove it . At this point D'Andrea said it was his lunchtime and asked Dobbins if he was through. Dobbins told him he was free to leave. He gave him a pass and D'Andrea left . D'Andrea went back to his section and went out for lunch , sat around in the fresh air for a while and decided he was too sick to go back to work , whereupon , he got a pass to the medical office from his foreman . The medical office took his temperature and he asked for permission to go home. He stated that the nurse said he had a temperature at that time ." After D'Andrea left the factory he called Business Agent Nelson who was in the East Hartford plant. Nelson asked him to go to the union hall in Southington and meet him there. He gave Nelson an affidavit of what had taken place during his interrogation.34 D'Andrea was called again to the security office the following day, May 12. The same investigators , Dobbins and Crosson were present . Dobbins commenced asking how D ' Andrea was feeling that day and D 'Andrea said, "I am not feeling as bad as I did yesterday when you were making me nervous . But I am not feeling very well." Dobbins said , "yesterday you had a picnic in here, but today it is going to be different ." D'Andrea said that if Dobbins was going to make him nervous and pressure him his probation Valliere was of the same opinion "The Employer produced no medical records "The affidavit was introduced by Respondent and is in substantial agreement with D ' Andrea's testimony. the way he did the previous day he would be sick again. Finally Dobbins said, "I am going to ask you some questions. You're going to give me some answers and when you are through you can go back to work." He told D'Andrea that he could take notes but that he would be talking pretty fast. D'Andrea asked what the questions were and Dobbins said, "You solicited on company time." D'Andrea said, "That's false." Dobbins said, "Mr. D'Andrea we know you did, you know you did, and we can prove it and we will." He raised his voice and D'Andrea said, "Mr. Crosson I am not feeling well. I would like a pass to medical." He spoke to Crosson because Dobbins was angry. Dobbins asked D'Andrea if he would like to go into the other room. D'Andrea stepped to the door and found a uniformed man there and said, "I am not going in there with this uniformed man here. This place is like a police station." Dobbins laughed and said, "Mr. D'Andrea these men have been here for over 25 years. Really you must think you are a pretty good actor and we are going to give you the chance to see how good you are." D'Andrea again asked to go to the medical office. About this point Dobbins or Crosson called for D'Andrea's supervisor who came and sent him to the medical office. While they were waiting for Foreman Mason, Dobbins said, "You know Mr. D'Andrea you're really something. I'll bet you think this is really something." D'Andrea answered, "Mr. Dobbins, I don't think this is funny at all. You might think so, but I am a working man. I have got a family to think of What you people are doing to me isn't right." Dobbins answered, "You just sit there. Nobody is going to bother you." When Mason arrived Dobbins said, "Mr. D'Andrea doesn't seem to be very cooperative" and asked Mason to make a pass for the medical office D'Andrea went to the medical office where he was examined by a company doctor after the nurse took his temperature twice. When she took his temperature the second time she said some people just have an unusually high temperature. The doctor examined D'Andrea and D'Andrea asked for a pass to go home. The doctor sent him into another room to rest and D'Andrea found Foreman Mason and General Foreman Richey present. At this point they told him that he would be discharged unless he agreed to quit and urged him to quit so that it would be easier for him to get another job. The Respondent called both investigators Dobbins and Crosson to the witness stand. Dobbins, who testified first, related that D'Andrea arrived at 9 45 and took out a notebook and said he was going to take notes to which the investigators acquiesced D'Andrea then asked why he was there and was told "that he was asked to come down at a reasonable request of management and immediately he offered himself that he knew the reason why he was down there It was because recently he had become a union steward and had submitted a grievance. And because of this the company, namely his foreman, leadmen, and his fellow workers were conspiring against him. Then he accused me also as an investigator as being a tool of the company's." Dobbins then told D'Andrea that his fellow workers had made an allegation that he had been prevailing on them during working hours to join the Union, pressuring them, soliciting them, referring to some of them as scabs, and also they alleged that he refused to work with some people who are not union members in the normal course of their duties. He was told that the interview was held to give him an opportunity to tell his side of the story. D'Andrea would not answer any questions but would pose other questions. D'Andrea 956 DECISIONS OF NATIONAL LABOR RELATIONS BOARD complained that while he was being interviewed he was surrounded by policemen and he was told they were not policemen . He was told that if he wanted to leave he could do so . He was free to go anytime At this time he said he wanted a glass of water or something and left the office and was gone for 10 minutes with Crosson. When he returned Dobbins asked him if he wanted to terminate the interview and he said no , but said that he wanted a lawyer or he wanted to call the Labor Board . He was told that it would soon be his lunch period . He would be free to take it when he wanted to but he preferred to continue the interview . D'Andrea became very theatrical . Dobbins stated that he told D'Andrea that nine employees had made the allegations that he was accused of . At 11:27 Dobbins concluded the interview and D ' Andrea went back to his department . As the above account indicates, Dobbins' testimony was almost valueless as it was given almost entirely in conclusionary terms. Respondent's counsel asked him directly whether D ' Andrea asked for representation by a shop steward and Dobbins answered that he told him no. Dobbins denied raising his voice and denied that D'Andrea raised his voice. Dobbins occasionally referred to a document of which he had a copy in the investigation file. He testified that it was a time log that he made up for the investigation. He testified he made the log as a personal habit and he usually keeps a running log of the time witnesses come and the time they leave . On cross-examination he said that he sends the log as part of his report at times. He further testified that he kept it in pencil and had the secretary at the Southington plant type it up for him. He further testified that he was told by the personnel office who to interview , but later testified that he was told by his supervisor , Connolly, who to interview and that Connolly directed him throughout the investigation . He testified that the comment in the investigation report that he was instructed by personnel not to interview D ' Andrea was incorrect and that he had been instructed by his supervisor. When Crosson took the witness stand he testified on the contrary that it was he that made up the log. He was regularly assigned to the Southington plant where this took place and he normally kept a log to determine the amount of time that it was necessary for a second investigator to be assigned to the Southington plant. He testified that the logs that he keeps are never included in the investigative file. It is simply his personal record. He also testified that he was requested by the personnel office not to interview D'Andrea and that he relayed their request to Connolly who agreed . Both Crosson and Dobbins distinguished themselves with their evasiveness with regard to their contact with the personnel office. Returning to Dobbins , after he was cautioned to stop generalizing and attempt to recall what was said during the interview , he testified that he did not recall anything that was said by anybody other than what he had already testified to, whereupon Respondent 's counsel gave him his report to read to refresh his recollection . He bagan to read the report into evidence and was stopped. Whereupon , Respondent ' s counsel elicited denials of specific statements attributed to him by D'Andrea, including the statements , "we know you are guilty, we're going to prove it," and the statement that D ' Andrea told him that he was ill . He testified he did not recall D'Andrea making any mention of leadmen Sullivan. He testified that he never asked any questions about D'Andrea 's union activities on his own time . He identified the form on which he had begun to write a statement for D'Andrea and recalled that D'Andrea examined it and questioned the language "of my own free will and accord, without fear" saying "I am with fear - you have the place surrounded by policemen." He stated that nothing was mentioned about signing the statement because he did not take a statement. Regarding the second interview, he testified that D'Andrea came in and he told D'Andrea that he wanted to talk to him if he was willing to cooperate. He asked D'Andrea if he wanted to talk about the three allegations and D'Andrea could answer the question yes or no. D'Andrea merely said that he was ill and wanted to go to the medical office. Crosson testified, as I've stated above, that he was in charge of the investigation, that when D'Andrea came into the office on the first occasion he informed him that if he wished to have a drink or use the lavatory,, or to smoke or to terminate the interview, dust feel free to ask. He testified that after a half an hour, approximately 10:15, D'Andrea asked if he could have a drink and was given permission to leave the room. When he left the room Crosson remembered that he had no way of getting into the men's room as the men's lavatory requires a key to enter the room, whereupon he said to Dobbins, "Bill, I'm afraid this poor man won't be able to get into the men's lavatory. He has no key." And he left the office and searched for D'Andrea and found him in the men's locker room which he described as being downstairs in the main plant at Southington. However, in relation to his office, it apparently was 15 or 20 feet; it has no lock on it. He stated that D'Andrea was "taking his personal relief," at the conclusion of which he asked D'Andrea if he wanted to wash his hands and, for some reason known only to him, he then escorted him to the foremen's lavatory where D'Andrea washed his hands, combed his hair, coughed, and said, "I think I'm coming down with a cold or a sore throat." Crosson asked if he wanted to go to medical or to continue the interview and D'Andrea said he wished to continue the interview. He testified that this is the only time that D'Andrea indicated that he was sick. He denied that he made any comment to the effect that he thought D'Andrea was running away. Crosson was not asked to give any other account of the interview, so I have only Dobbins' generalized and conclusionary account of what took place by way of controversion to D'Andrea's. I conclude that Crosson and Dobbins managed between them to make as coercive an atmosphere as possible for the interview with D'Andrea. I think that in all probability D'Andrea brought this on himself in large part by his insistence on taking notes, his demand for the presence of a shop steward, and his quite correct statement that he was the victim of a conspiracy by his fellow workers because of his successful grievance. While I have no reason to believe that the investigators are normally dispassionate in their investigation, I believe that they were exasperated by D'Andrea's attitude and accordingly conducted an interrogation very much along the lines that D'Andrea testified to. I observed D'Andrea closely on the witness stand and I noted that he was very intense and nervous. I believe that the circumstances under which he was interrogated aggravated this condition and that he was probably physically upset as a result of the interviews. I do not consider that the fact that he was able to go from the company plant to the union office and give a statement on each of the two occasions to Business Agent Nelson is in any way inconsistent with this finding. Once free of the conditions which caused his nervous state, I can readily believe that D'Andrea was able to function in a normal fashion, and his recognition of the UNITED AIRCRAFT CORP. need to record what had taken place at the earliest possible moment would necessarily have added to his determination to overcome his physical distress in order to proceed with the business at hand. I do not accept Crosson,s account of the reason he followed D'Andrea to the men's room. I think that he thought D'Andrea was terminating the interview and the interviewers were not yet ready to reach this point. While Respondent appears to contend that D'Andrea's statement that he was "with fear" is a fabrication and that he had nothing to fear, it is clear that in fact he was on the verge of being discharged and he was discharged, and to the extent that he was obviously well aware of the situation with regard to the complaints of Bryda, Swett, and Licnikas, I can well believe that he was apprehensive of, if not convinced of, the imminence of his discharge. I do not reach the conclusion- that the investigators acted in an overbearing and coercive fashion easily. If either, or both, of them had revealed an inclination to testify candidly and without evasion, I might be more inclined to credit what little they denied of D'Andrea's testimony. However their testimony and their demeanor, adds corroboration to D'Andrea's account. Accordingly, I find that the interrogations of D'Andrea were coercive within the meaning of Section 8(a)(l) of the Act. 8: Rooney Howard Rooney was called to the security office where he was interviewed by Security Investigators McLaughlin and Clifford." I shall not burden this already overlong Decision with a second account of the interview. It is fully set forth above. Clifford' s testimony made it completely clear that he had almost no recollection of the interview with Rooney. However he did recall , apparently, that the purpose of the interview was to investigate the alleged violation of a company rule regarding solicitation for union membership on company time, or , perhaps, talking union business during working time on company property . The latter testimony was obviously a surmise on the part of Clifford based on his recollection that it was reported to him that some foreman , otherwise unidentified, had seen two people talking and one of them had a blue book. In other respects , Clifford' s testimony substantially corroborated that of Rooney as to what took place. Viewed as an inquiry into talking about union business on company time, the interrogation of Rooney was clearly coercive, because the rule; as I have pointed out above, was invalid . Viewed as an inquiry into possible solicitation of union membership , a somewhat different problem is raised . Here Clifford testified that they had already interviewed Carroll and she apparently told the truth, and her account of the conversation revealed that there was no solicitation involved . The'situation is somewhat like that in Aladdin Industries , Inc., -147 NLRB 1392, where the Board found a violation based in part on the fact that the investigation was conducted after respondent had ascertained the true facts, which established that the real purpose of the employer was to learn of the protected activities . In the instant'case the persistence of the security agents in interviewing Rooney, after ascertaining that there was no breach of the rule invoked , leads me inevitably to the conclusion that the interview was conducted solely for the purpose of harassing Rooney as a steward , and making him realize that his activities on "McLaughlin was not called to testify, Clifford was. 957 behalf of the Union would not be dealt with lightly by Respondent. I do not accept the proposition that the investigation division of Respondents is a sort of a juggernaut that once put into motion, cannot be stopped until it has completed its journey. It is quite apparent that the security investigators were in constant communication, not only with their supervisor but with the personnel office, and as some of the investigators testified the investigators normally sought "approbation" before proceeding in an investigation to query the alleged suspect. In Rooney's case there was nothing to inquire about, and but for the effect of the interrogation on Rooney, there appears to have been no occasion for an interview at all. Viewed against a background of Respondents' union animus, and particularly Respondents' watchfulness over the activities of the stewards in the plants, I believe that the interrogation was meant to be and was coercive of Rooney and of any employees who might have had occasion to deal with him in his capacity as a shop steward to refrain therefrom. I find that the interrogation violates Section 8(a)(1) of the Act, as alleged. 9. Buchans Buchans testified that he was interviewed by two investigators, Clifford and Krieger, concerning a complaint filed against him by a guard, that he told them his side of the story and that it was written into a statement. He testified that he asked to show the statement to an attorney before signing it, and they declined to let him take it. He called his foreman, George Johnson, who recommended that he sign the statement and told them that he would sign it if he could add his own statement to it, first that he was denied a shop steward, and second that he was denied a copy of the statement. They permitted him to do this, he signed it, and went back to work. A few days later he was called back, and was handed a typewritten document which the internal security investigators told him was a copy of his statement. He noted that it did not contain the caveats concerning calling a shop steward and seeking a copy of the statement, and declined to sign it, whereupon they called in a third party who told him that he had no right to union representation, he had no right to a copy of anything that went on in the office, and abjured him to sign it. He refused to sign it and went back to his job. Aside from the fact that Buchans was a union steward and that he asked for and was refused the services of a steward when he was interviewed, nothing in his interview or in the incident that occasioned it had anything to do with the Union. Among the 37 files which Respondent introduced for purposes of comparison as to the investigations are 5 having to do with obscenity directed to guards or abuse of guards by employees So it is clear that it is not unusual for an alleged infraction of this nature to result in an investigation. I can see no way in which the interrogation of Buchans could serve to coerce any employee with regard to his union membership or activities or concerted activities. Accordingly, insofar as the interrogation of Buchans is alleged to be a violative interrogation, excessive and coercive, with regard to union activities, I recommend that the complaint be dismissed. 958 DECISIONS OF NATIONAL LABOR RELATIONS BOARD D. Additional Alleged Violations of Section 8(a)(1) The General Counsel alleges that Respondents violated 8(a)(1) by the interrogation by Investigators Massett and Vardon at the Middletown plant of employees, concerning their union membership and that of other employees, on October 20 and 25, 1966. The record does not disclose that Massett and Vardon, or either of them, interviewed anyone on October 20, 1966. The only employee other than shop steward Menard who was interviewed on the 25th was Armand Morin. Raymond Desloges testified that he was interviewed by Vardon sometime in October 1966 concerning Menard, and Frank Partridge testified that he was interviewed by Booker and Vardon on October 19, 1966. Morin was interviewed by Massett and Vardon. Of course, the rules that I have applied to determine whether the interviews of Menard, Nelson, D'Andrea, Rooney, and Buchans were violative, apply equally well to employees who are not shop stewards. I have discussed elsewhere the interrogations of Morin and Desloges. With regard to Partridge, he was called in on the 19th to be interviewed by Security Investigators Booker and Vardon. Vardon initiated the conversation, pointing his finger at Partridge and saying, "The first thing I want you to understand is that nothing that is said in this room is to be repeated outside this room. If it is you will be back here." He then said, "We have evidence that you have been discussing union matters on company time." Partridge denied this allegation, whereupon Vardon stated that they had evidence that Partridge had been discussing union business with Menard during company time. Partridge said, "Well, if you have evidence I suggest that you present it and use it as you see fit." The investigators showed Partridge three pictures from which he identified Menard He told them that the only conversation he had had with Menard was that Menard came up to him and introduced himself and welcomed him to the department. A statement was written out and signed by Partridge. In view of my findings concerning the investigation of Menard and his discharge, it is clear that applying the rules set forth above, that each of the interrogations is violative of Section 8(a)(1) of the Act. The basic rationale for this conclusion is that the inquiry did not relate to the enforcement of a valid rule. Of course, the antiunion background of the Employer is present in all cases. There is no evidence that either Partridge or Desloges was informed of the purpose of the interview. With regard to Desloges, after he had informed the investigators that the only approach made to him with regard to the Union had been in the parking lot, which was clearly not in violation of the rules, the interrogators continued asking if anyone else had asked him to join the Union during his working hours, and asking who had solicited him on the parking lot. I find that each of the three interrogations was violative of Section 8(a)(1) of the Act. The General Counsel contends that Respondent violated the Act by a threat to steward Menard on October 25 by Foreman Karlon, and on October 31 by General Foreman Wolak, and by a threat to steward Rooney by Foreman Cochran. The gist of the alleged threat by Karlon is contained in Menard's testimony. Menard stated that when he came back from his security investigation he told Karlon what had happened, and stated in effect that it had been suggested to him that he quit the Union and it might work out better for him if he did. Karlon told Menard that he wasn't admitting that it would but it might help out if he did quit the Union, and that if the Company intended to fire Menard they would let him know by the following Friday. Karlon testified that he had this conversation but that he did not make the statement attributed to him. He testified that Menard showed him his pocket booklet and his union badge and said that he was going to send them back to the Union, to which Karlon answered that it was entirely up to him. This is a direct issue of credibility and I credit Menard. Karlon was an unsatisfactory witness. He showed a tendency to exaggerate where he thought it would improve Respondent's case. Karlon testified that he had a short memory and wrote notes to himself to help him recall in the future anything that took place. Yet he testified he did not write a note concerning the conversation of the 25th but denied that his memory of the conversation was hazy. I have already indicated in my discussion of Menard's discharge that I considered Karlon an untrustworthy witness. I believe that it is entirely consistent with his character and with his activities that he would have said what Menard attributed to him. With regard to the allegation concerning General Foreman Wolak on October 31 Menard's whole testimony concerning the conversation was that Walick, having been informed that Menard had become a member of the negotiating committee, "wanted to know how I could become a member of the negotiating committee if I had informed the foreman the week before that I was going to quit the Union, and I told him that I told Bob Karlon that I was thinking about quitting the Union. I didn't say that I was going to positively and I also told him that over the weekend that I did some thinking and I had decided to stay in the Union." I can see no threat, interrogation, or other violative conduct in this conversation and insofar as the complaint alleges it to be violative it should be dismissed. Rooney testified that when Foreman Cochran inquired of him what he was talking about to Carroll36 the incident closed by Cochran saying, "Mr. when you put that [union] badge on you're on thin ice" and walked away. Cochran testified that at the close of the conversation after he had accused Rooney of talking about union activities and Rooney shrugged his shoulders he remarked that Rooney was on rather thin ice. He explained by that that he meant that Rooney had been absent from his work station without permission, had made errors in his work, had questioned Cochran's authority, and had refused to search for a tool. On cross-examination it appeared that all of these charges boil down to an incident where Rooney had made a mistake in setting a gauge, another incident where Rooney went to the personnel office to file a grievance against Cochran, and the incident where Rooney questioned the authority of the leadman to come into the crib in which he worked which was accessible only to authorized personnel. He also testified that all of these incidents which gave rise to his dissatisfaction with Rooney took place after he became the union steward although Rooney had been employed for approximately 2 years in the plant. I think that even accepting Cochran's version a violation is made out. Clearly the activities that gave rise to his admonition or threat to Rooney were union activities and clearly as I have found above were not in violation of any valid company rule. Be that as it may, I do not accept Cochran's testimony but I believe Rooney's in this instance. Cochran was an evasive witness and his demeanor added no credit to his testimony which was itself unsatisfactory. "The incident was discussed above UNITED AIRCRAFT CORP. I find that the incident of October 25 and the Cochran incident constitute violations of Section 8(a)(1). John Farrall, a shop steward, testified that he was signing up a new member, Richard Jackson, in Jackson's department while both he and Jackson were on their luncheon break. Foreman Frank Bogden , Jackson's foreman, came up to them and asked what they were doing. Farrall held up the application card and the dues-authorization card that had just been signed by Jackson whereupon Bogden took them from his hand and told him he would give them back at 4 o'clock. It was then 3:45 in the morning. At 4 o'clock he told Farrall that he wasn't through with them and that he would return them later, which he did, asking Farrall if he and Jackson were both punched out for lunch and advising him that he could be fired if he wasn 't punched out. Farrall told him that he knew the rules and according to the contract it was legal and that both he and Jackson were punched out. Bogden did not testify. The General Counsel contends that the above incident violates Section 8(a)(1) of the Act I consider that he is clearly right. Farrall and Jackson were engaged in protected, concerted activity. They were in violation of no rules of the Respondent or provisions of the contract. Bogden , on behalf of the Respondent, had no warrant to interfere in any way. His action in taking the cards from Farrall and withholding them from him until later was clearly coercive and in violation of Section 8(a)(1) of the Act. I so find. Similarly Bogden's interrogation of employee Jackson as to what he was doing was equally violative. Ronald Vincent testified that the first day he was a union steward he wore a blue union steward's shirt and button to work. In the morning , while he was checking in, Foreman Ed Grous came to him and said that he should not be hanging around . Grous said that wearing a blue shirt and badge made him a target, he stuck out like a sore thumb, and everyone would be watching him David Williams, also a union steward, testified that while he was walking through his department on business Foreman Grous stopped him and asked where he was going When he answered that he was going to his machine Grous said that he should watch his step because he was being watched and he should stop carrying the pink cards" in his shirt pocket because it looked bad. He advised that Williams should not talk so much because it looked like he was talking union business on company time. Williams had been wearing the `blue union shirt and badge and carrying the pink union application cards in his pocket for a week previous to this incident. Other than to characterize the complaint allegations as harassment, Respondents did not meet the allegations." General Counsel contends that each of the incidents are violative of the Act and constituted threats of discharge and surveillance. I see no threat of discharge in the incidents. There is no -doubt that Grous in effect warned both union stewards that they would be kept under close surveillance as long as they were union stewards. The allegations dealt with here go to the very heart of the tripartite relationship between the Union, the Employer, and the stewards. The steward in order to be effective must be able to conduct his union business within the valid rules laid down by the employer and the union. There is no contention here that either Williams or Vincent was doing anything wrong , but Grous nevertheless called on them to warn them simply because they were stewards, that they would be watched. While he might "Union application cards 959 very well have meant this to be a friendly warning, against the background of the Employer's union animus and its vigorous, and as I have 'found above, discriminatory enforcement of its rules when they relate to stewards, I consider that Grous' "warnings" are coercive within the meaning of Section 8(a)(1) of the Act and I so find Finally, the General Counsel contends that Respondents violated Section 8(a)(1) of the Act by its actions in threatening to discharge Menard, Nelson, and D'Andrea if they failed to resign which actions took place at their termination interviews. I have found with regard to Menard and Nelson that the terminations were unlawful and violative of Section 8(a)(3) and with regard to D'Andrea that the termination was not unlawful. As the Board has frequently found that a termination under these circumstances violative of Section 8(a)(3) is derivatively violative of Section 8(a)(1) I shall of course so find, but the offer of a choice to resign rather than be discharged adds nothing to the violation. It is simply an offer to falsify the records and apparently is unrelated to union activity. I see no warrant in finding a separate unfair labor practice based upon these three incidents. E. The Refusal-To-Bargain Allegations The refusal-to-bargain allegations fall into two general fields of inquiry: The first deals with the alleged unilateral change in working conditions by the refusal of Respondents to honor an historic shop steward-employee ratio formula agreed to originally in 1950, and the others, by its refusal at various times to call shop stewards and process grievances through normal channels. Every contract between Respondents, either Hamilton Standard or Pratt & Whitney, since 1950 has contained a provision which states: The number of shop stewards and the area of the shop which each steward shall represent for the purpose of investigating and adjusting grievances under this grievance procedure shall be mutually agreed upon by the Company and the Union. The number of shop stewards and the areas which they represent shall be subject to review upon request of either the Company or the Union. After the 1950 contract between Lodge 1746 and Pratt & Whitney was executed, the parties on January 4, 1951, executed a side agreement which provided in pertinent part as follows: It is agreed that there shall be 60 stewards recognized by the Company based on a plant-wide complement of 12,000 employees. For each increase plant-wide of 225 above 12,000 employees, the Union shall be entitled to name one additional steward. The allocation of the steward to a specific area shall be determined by the Union provided, however, that in the assignment of stewards by the Union no more than one steward shall be allowed for each 150 employees. In a reduction of force below 12,000, it is agreed that the Union shall reduce the recognized number of stewards by one (1) for each reduction of five hundred employees down to a level of 9,000 employees. If the total plant employees are reduced to below 9,000, and no agreement has been reached by the parties in accordance with Section 1, Article V, which would "Foreman Grous died after the above testimony was given, but before being called to testify. 960 DECISIONS OF NATIONAL LABOR RELATIONS BOARD replace the then current understanding, then and thereafter the number of stewards to be recognized by the Company shall be equal to one steward for each 225 employees on a plant-wide basis. The Company will notify the Union each three (3) months of the areas, if any, that, under this understanding because of an increase in employment therein will be permitted an additional steward to be recognized. No side agreement between the Hamilton Standard Division and Local 743 appears to have been signed. Butler Seedman, president of Local 743 testified that "Prior to 1954 we had a steward on a ratio of 1 to 225 employees." Seedman testified that the ratio changed in 1954 in that in negotiations the Union proposed that it be lowered to a ratio of 1 to 100. The Employer counterproposed 1 to 175 which was accepted and subsequently ratified by the employees. He testified that the ratio of 1 to 175 had never been changed thereafter. He testified that from the year 1960 until 1966 he had never had occasion to compare the number of stewards with the number of employees and in fact had not called for up-to-date figures on the plant census. However, he also testified that he was sure that the ratio remained about I to 175.19 Seedman testified that he would annually submit to the Employer the union proposal setting forth the number of steward areas that he felt was necessary together with the names of the stewards who could cover those areas which he was able to fill, and he could only conclude from the Company's agreement with his proposal that it was within the "historic" ratio. He admitted that there were years in which he definitely knew that the Company was recognizing more stewards than the ratio would permit but he did not see fit to propose a reduction in stewards to fit the ratio. He also knew that there were occasions when the Union had fewer. He also testified that in every negotiation in which he was involved the Union asked that the ratio be reduced and asked for more stewards. He acknowledged that between 1958 and 1959 there was a layoff of approximately 2,500 people but that only 2 stewards were removed during that time. Herman Muise, who was business representative of District 19, assigned to Lodge 1746, and had prior to that time been the occupant of various offices of steward committeemen, vice president, and president since 1951, testified that he had been involved in the negotiations of 1953, 1955, 1957, 1962, 1965, and 1966 between Lodge 1746 and Respondent Pratt & Whitney, and that the allocation of stewards was based in each contract upon population of steward areas. He testified that the formula between 1950 and 1959 was that set forth in the letter of agreement which I have quoted above, but he also testified that sometime along the line, first apparently in 1957, it was changed to be based upon a ratio of I steward to each 150 population within a steward area. He testified that in every negotiation the Union requested additional stewards, generally based on their desire for one steward to each department and in some cases I steward for each foreman. On each such occasion the Employer rejected their requests. He testified there was actually no implementation of the formula, "there was just a carryover from the formula that had existed throughout "Seedman 's testimony in this and other regards was more conclusionary and self-serving than illuminating . He contradicted himself variously that he did and did not check population figures and compute ratios I find however that he did not, during this period, compute ratios presumably because the Union was unable to fill the stewards positions that the Employer had agreed to , wherefore it was not particularly useful to seek agreement on a greater number of positions. the years . . at times sometimes during the period of the year perhaps once a year perhaps twice a year the union official who might be in charge at that time . . . noting that perhaps areas might need readjusting in regard to population, might request a meeting with the chief personnel adviser to ascertain the population figures within the areas ...... The Respondents contend that there was never a formula except to the extent that the provision that in the assignment of stewards by the Union no more than 1 steward shall be allowed for each 150 employees, which Respondents referred to as the overloading provision, was kept alive by all parties throughout the years. Respondents contend that the contract means just exactly what it says. Each contract with both Unions provided for negotiations and agreement between the parties of both the number of stewards and the areas and at various times such negotiations were held and agreements reached. The basic problem really is whether a "historic" formula had ever arisen and whether its existence was of such immutability that Respondents were guilty of a refusal to bargain by unilaterally changing it after the 1966 contracts were agreed to. The testimony of both Seedman and Muise reveals clearly that the formula was by no means immutable. It was in fact changed according to their testimony from 1:225 to 1:175 with Lodge 743 and from the somewhat more complicated formula set forth in the 1950 contract addendum to 1:150 with Lodge 1746. Both changes took place according to their testimony some time in the mid 1950's. The documentary evidence before me profusely illustrates that the parties in fact recognized that there was a formula throughout the bargaining. The formula in no instance except the 1950 addendum was reduced to writing.'0 Each of the parties relies on the minutes of the various meetings , which were supplied in evidence, to support their case in certain respects, but each of them decries the unreliability of the minutes in other respects when it does not support their position. However a reading of the minutes as a whole, together with other documentary evidence, including a prolific exchange of correspondence between the Union and the Respondents, makes it clear that whenever the parties came to issue on the number of shop stewards they had in mind the ratio as it then existed. But while I conclude that a ratio existed from year to year, I cannot conclude that it supplanted the direct terms of the contracts which provided for interim agreement of these substantive issues. This conclusion is supported by the fact that the Union clearly attempted, during and after the negotiation of every contract, to change the number of When the General Counsel called Muise and Seedman to testify and the Repondents called Vandervoort on behalf of Hamilton Standard and Morse on behalf of Pratt & Whitney to testify, it is clear that, as frankly stated by Respondents ' counsel, none of the witnesses had any clear recollection of the negotiations that had taken place back over the years That this is only natural must be accepted . All of the parties called to testify had been involved in literally hundreds of negotiation sessions over the many years that they had occupied the various offices, and each of them had obviously refreshed himself from whatever materials they had at hand before taking the witness stand in the instant proceeding Their testimony was largely self-serving and occasionally demonstrably erroneous . While Seedman and Muise took exception with some of the statements appearing in "the minutes " prepared by the Employer and furnished the Union with regard to each negotiation meeting , it is quite clear that except for the fact that they do not contain the same emphasis which the various parties in afterthought and under the circumstances of the hearing herein would have them display, they are fairly reliable reports of what took place UNITED AIRCRAFT CORP. stewards and accordingly the areas in which the stewards would operate. To find as the General Counsel would have me find, that the ratio formula achieved by the magic of the addition of the word "historic" a supra-contractual status would do violence to the contracts which each Union entered into throughout the period from 1950 to the present. The General Counsel argues that if there was a steward formula that was in existence for many years and suddenly the Company repudiates the formula after negotiations have terminated and the contract has been executed, this repudiation constitutes bad faith in collective bargaining . But this is , not the case; the formula was permitted to remain in existence year after year but the Union never considered that it was immutable, the Union in fact constantly attempted to revise it to provide for more shop stewards, even during the years that it could not fill the positions provided by the action of the formula. The formula after all is nothing more than the custom of the parties to base their computation of the number of stewards on a ratio between stewards and employees rather than some other basis such as a steward for each department, building , shift, or other geographical or temporal subdivision, or a steward ratio based on the number of grievances or union members. I do not view the action of the Company in the postcontract negotiations in 1966 with regard to the stewards as any more than the Company's offer to increase the ratio which is really no different than the Union's constant attempt to reduce it. The contractual provision embodied in every contract must have envisioned negotiations with regard to the number of stewards that should be appointed. It clearly so provided. I have never known it to be considered a refusal to bargain for an employer to offer less when a union demands more, and I see no refusal to bargain in the situation as it is here disclosed to be. The General Counsel appears to contend that the negotiations were completed and that this position taken by the Employer was a unilateral repudiation of the terms of the completed negotiations . I have before me the verbatim transcripts of the four negotiating sessions which resulted in the two contracts with which we are here concerned. There was no bargaining in those negotiations regarding the number of stewards. The parties in fact agreed that the new contracts would contain the same language as the old, which obviously includes the provision for a mutual agreement on the number of stewards and the areas in which each should operate.41 I do not find that the refusal to continue to apply the formula in the same ratio as that applied under former contracts constituted a unilateral change in working conditions. On the contrary, the evidence demonstrates that the parties normally, pursuant to the contractual provision, met together after the contract was executed and attempted to effectuate the provision by agreement on "The real bone of contention appears to be the provision in the contract that the Employer will pay for the time of stewards up to 2 hours per week spent in investigating br handling grievances At one point in the negotiation sessions covered ' in evidence the Employer in fact told the Union that they could have as many stewards as they wanted to as long as the Union was prepared to pay for it , but the Union would not consider this at the present time . The Union has a large number of union stewards as distinguished from shop stewards , and their function appears to be somewhat of an intermediary between the shop stewards who negotiate with the Employer and the employees. The union stewards , however, are not recognized by the Employer for the purposes of negotiating grievances nor is any part of their time paid for by the Employer when used in furtherance of the Union's business. 961 the number of shop stewards . That the Employer may have been impelled in the instant situation , as the General Counsel contends , by limiting the number of shop stewards to limit the "presence" of the Union among the employees because of its union animus and in the hopes that the Union would thereby be less successful in convincing employees that they should join is irrelevant in my opinion , and it is equally irrelevant that for the first time in 6 years the Union was in a position to fill more shop steward appointments , as contended by the General Counsel and the Union . This contention does not seem to be borne out by the facts which reveal that the Union up until the time of the hearing had not filled all of the shop steward vacancies to which the Employer had agreed. I shall recommend that the allegation , that the Employer refused to bargain by unilaterally changing working conditions in its refusal to recognize an historic shop steward -employee ratio formula , be dismissed. In connection with the alleged ratio, the second allegation of a violation of Section 8(a)(5) concerns an alleged oral threat by Attorney Wells, in a telephone conversation to Attorney Ratner , that unless the Union, in this case Lodge 1746, agreed to change from the type of dues-deduction card previously used to an IBM card and additionally agreed to set up new light occupational groups for seniority purposes , not theretofore in existence, the Employer in the negotiations concerning the number of shop stewards in the areas in which they are to serve would adopt and maintain an adamant position. The General Counsel contends that the contract entered into and already ratified at that time , foreclosed any right of the Employer to bargain with regard to the form of the cards or the occupational groups. The General Counsel also contends that , as set forth above, the issue of the shop stewards was resolved by the agreement other than to mechanically apply the "historic shop steward -employee ratio formula" to the then existing population in the plant. The evidence consisted of the testimony of the two attorneys, Ratner and Wells. While there was disagreement in their recollection of the conversations which gave rise to the allegation, it was clear that Wells in essence told Ratner that the Employer wanted to set up a new set of light occupational groups for purposes of seniority , especially with regard to layoff, to cover the situation where women were in the same occupational groups as men but were not able to do all the jobs, some of which might be heavy. Under the contract as it now exists women might be senior and be the only employees left in a deep layoff and be unable to do the heavy work entailed . The Employer wanted also to have the checkoff cards printed on IBM cards which would change the size and shape of the checkoff card , so that the checkoff might be more readily handled by the Employer's payroll system. Ratner took the viewpoint that both of the changes constituted changes in the conditions established under the contract which the parties had just entered into, and that the Union was not going to renegotiate any part of that contract , whereupon Wells pointed out that there remained to be negotiated the number of shop stewards and that if the Union were to be adamant with regard to the IBM cards and the light occupational groups, they were liable to find that their adamancy provoked an adamancy on the part of the Employer with regard to the shop steward issue. The transcript of the negotiations which gave rise to the contracts between the Union and the Respondents revealed that the parties agreed that nothing remained in 962 DECISIONS OF NATIONAL LABOR RELATIONS BOARD issue between them other than to establish the wording and color of the checkoff cards, and to negotiate, through subcommittees, concerning changes in the appendixes to the contract at the East Hartford plant which were labeled A and B and dealt with noninterchangeable occupational groups and seniority areas, which changes were necessitated by the fact that the Employer had closed or reduced some departments and increased or opened others, thereby abolishing or adding seniority areas and occupational groups There can be no doubt that the parties may at any time during the life of a contract agree to renegotiate the matters contained therein, or meet and negotiate concerning matters not covered within the terms of the contract. Necessarily, if the parties may negotiate or renegotiate the terms of a contract during its life, it must be possible for either party to request such negotiations. Surely the law does not require that negotiations of this type must arise spontaneously. It would obviously be inequitable to consider that the mere request for consideration of an issue already resolved by the contract is a violation of Section 8(a)(5). There remains of course only the contention made by the General Counsel that Respondents in effect threatened to unilaterally change another condition of employment, i.e., the so-called historic ratio, unless the Union acquiesced in its request. Inasmuch as I have found above that Respondents' action with regard to the "historic" ratio does not constitute a unilateral change, I can hardly find that a threat to do that very act constitutes a threat to make a unilateral change. Finally, the Charging Party contends that Respondents threatened to and became adamant in the negotiations with regard to shop stewards in retaliation for the Charging Parties' lawful intention not to allow Respondents to "unsettle agreements which had been made on subjects that had been closed" by the contract which had been negotiated. But, as I have found above, the subject of the ratio is not an agreement that had been closed, and was a subject which remained to be negotiated. The negotiations which took place after the telephone call between Attorneys Wells and Ratner revealed on the one hand that Respondents seriously objected to raising the number of shop stewards to the point demanded by the Union, but that the Union, rather than present any rationale for their demand and negotiating with a view to reaching agreement, stood by their legal position that they had an absolute right to the imposition of the "historic" formula and hence to the number of stewards that they requested. The upshot of the negotiations was that they accepted the Respondents' offer under protest and filed the charges giving rise to this portion of the instant proceeding. Respondents, on the other hand, acknowledge that it declined to grant the Unions' request, but points out what is not seriously in dispute, that they offered to consider any need shown by the Union for a greater number of stewards, and in fact it appears that at least once since the occasions complained of the number of stewards has increased on the showing by the Union of the existence of such need. Accordingly, I can find no adamancy to the point of a violation of Section 8(a)(5) on the part of either the Union or the Employer, and I shall recommend that the complaint insofar as it alleges a violation of Section 8(a)(5) in this incident be dismissed. The General Counsel contends that the Respondents refused to bargain by refusing to furnish information necessary and relevant to the negotiation of the steward issue He contends particularly that Respondents violated the Act by refusing to furnish an up-to-date map of the Pratt & Whitney plant on which the steward areas could be drawn. The facts are not seriously in dispute as to the incident. On September 28, Union Representative Muise met with the Employer's Representative Morse in their first attempt to work out the number of stewards and the areas that they were to cover. Muise asked Morse for a map and Morse furnished him a copy of the 1964 steward area map. After some discussion, during which Muise asked Morse to prepare a proposal and Morse declined to do so stating that there had been "enough contentiousness about company suggestions in the past few weeks and he wanted to avoid any further," Morse suggested that Muise prepare a proposal and submit it to the Company. Muise agreed to do so, and said that he would call Morse's assistant, Hall, later that day. He called Hall and told him that the map was of no value, it was an old map, and Hall replied that they had no other map. Muise testified that he replied that a new map did exist because he had one before him dated in 1966 which did include the new construction areas. Hall asked if that was a steward map and Muise replied that it was not,°r but that it was one from which a steward map could be made. Hall agreed to relay the information to Morse. Muise's testimony makes the issue perfectly clear. This was no refusal to furnish relevant information. The Union in fact had the information and Muise testified that he had it before him when he talked to Hall. This is simply another example of the tendency of the Respondents and the Union to deal with each other in terms of legal positions and legal conclusions rather than in terms of the everyday necessities of getting along. For the Union to contend that the Company violated the Act in refusing to furnish a map is sheer sophistry. The Union has a right to information necessary in bargaining, but here the Union had the information and admits that the information it had was adequate for its purpose. I find no merit in the General Counsel's position. General Counsel further contends that Respondents demonstrated their bad faith by refusing to furnish information concerning the population in the plants by department within the steward areas, contending that the application of the formula required this information. There is no indication anywhere in the record that the steward areas were drawn along departmental lines or that the formula, such as it was, was necessarily applied along departmental lines, and the Union at all times contended and still contends that the formula must be the basis for the application of the shop steward areas, nevertheless I can see relevance to the request for the information in that conceivably the Union was prepared to request that a different type of formula should be adopted, namely, the formula once proposed, of one shop steward in each department subject presumably to the "overloading" agreement which all parties seemed to have understood ever since 1950. I can also see that it could be relevant even under the formula since the Union presumably would be interested in having its steward areas coincide with departments as nearly as possible for ease in handling grievances between the shop stewards and the foremen or department heads. Muise testified that he asked for the population by shift, by department, and by steward areas. He admitted that the Union had never before asked for population figures by department but explained that for purposes of selecting stewards, if there were a number of departments "There was no steward map in 1966 UNITED AIRCRAFT CORP. 963 in an area, the Union would prefer to appoint a steward out of one of the larger departments in the area rather than a steward out of a fragment of a department which could be located in the area that might have as few as 10 people. Morse suggested to Muise that he use the information which the Company was currently furnishing to the Union as a result of the stipulation which was entered into in the 100) court proceeding , which gave rise to the bargaining in the first place. Morse pointed out that the Company had no record from which the figures that Muise wanted could be drawn readily other than those which were furnished to the Union. The problem really concerned some departments which occur in various areas such as the toolcribs , inspectors , and the like. It is estimated that there are as many as 2,500 employees in a total plant population of 20,000 involved in such departments Morse suggested that the only way the Company could provide these figures would be to go physically into the department and count the people working there at any given time and he stated that the Union could as well do that as the Company. Muise admitted that the Union had been receiving change-of-status forms for all the employees, which showed transfers of individuals from one department to another and also copies of the master wage and salary cards showing where the people were assigned. He admitted that if he took the master wage and salary cards and the change-of-status forms that the documents would trace any individual right through the plant. He stated however that the Union did not have an adequate staff to keep up to date with the forms that they were furnished and therefore it would be easier for the Company, using these forms and presumably its computers, to determine the population by departments in areas, than it would for the Union. Asked whether the basis of the Union asking the Company to provide copies of these forms wasn't just so that he could do these very things, i.e., make the necessary computations , Muise's answer was, "Oh, no sir I'm sure that's not the basis for the request. I think the request was that our counsel felt that we had a statutory right to that information." Once again we see a situation where the real issue is not the refusal of the employer to furnish necessary information to the union, but rather the refusal of the employer to do the computation necessary to make the information valuable for the union's purpose. The Union here, by the testimony of Muise, had the information but did not have a staff adequate to collate it and draw the conclusions which the Union wanted. Muise's testimony seems to indicate that he felt that all the Employer had to do to get such information was push a button on the computer and it would roll out. What little I know of computers indicates, to me at least, that it is not all that simple. I cannot see that the Employer is guilty of an unfair labor practice in its refusal to accede to this demand. What the Employer in fact did was suggest that the Union take the information it had and attempt to work out the figures and if it failed to do so the Employer would send somebody into the departments to count heads and give the Union the information. This is not a situation where the Employer had readily available facts which the Union could ascertain only by expensive and inconvenient means. The question really is whether the Union or the Employer , both with the same basic information before them, should spend the time and, necessarily, money necessary to correlate the information to put it in the form in which the Union desired it. I know of nothing in the Act nor of any decision of the Board or the courts that requires the employer to acquiesce. Under the circumstances I shall recommend that this allegation too be dismissed. Finally the General Counsel alleges that Respondents violated Section 8(a)(5) of the Act by their failure and refusal under varying circumstances to call a shop steward at the request of their employees The allegation is broken down into three separate periods of time: from September 23 until December 12, 1966, during which time, although a contract was in being , no shop stewards had been designated, on and after September 26, concerning grievances which arose during the period prior to September 23 that Respondents had withdrawn recognition; and after December 12 when stewards had been named but foremen refused to call them at the request of employees. In addition the General Counsel alleges that Respondent Pratt & Whitney refused to bargain by its failure and refusal to call shop stewards during the interrogations of Nelson, Buchans, and Rooney by the security investigators. It will be recalled that each of those stewards requested representation by a shop steward when they were called to the security department. The contract between the Union and the Employer provides that differences "concerning the interpretation, application or compliance with the provisions of this agreement" are to be handled pursuant to the contractual grievance procedure. The contract provides "an employee having such a grievance may, after notice to his immediate supervisor take it up either directly with his foreman or with the shop steward who shall take it up with the employees' foremen." Respondents had provided in its publication of employee rules that employees may take up their complaints either with the personnel advisers or with their formen and suggest that the employees should consult with the foremen first "since many of these matters can be satisfactory settled by your foreman or supervisor." The contract provides that the shop steward shall be given an opportunity to be present at the adjustment of a grievance arising under the terms of the contract which is presented to the foreman directly by an employee but makes no provision regarding adjustment of grievances by personnel advisers. If an employee asks to have the assistance of a steward in presenting a grievance, the contract provides that the employee shall make a statement to the foreman identifying the specific nature of his grievance in simple terminology whereupon, Respondents admit, the foreman makes his own judgment as to whether the grievance raised by the employee is one that is cognizable under the terms of the contract. If he decides that it is not, he refuses to call a steward. Under these circumstances the employee may file a grievance by going to the Union on his own time. When a foreman declines to call a steward either the employee concerned or a shop steward may sign a grievance alleging that the foreman has improperly refused to call a steward. Such grievances are not arbitrable on a mandatory basis and Respondents have never agreed to submit such a grievance to arbitration. If a grievance is not adjusted at the first step, orally, it must be reduced to writing on forms obtained from the foreman and signed by the employee. We thus have four separate issues to decide with relation to calling a shop steward- 1. Whether Respondents had a duty during a period of time when no contract was in existence and no shop stewards had been designated to call a shop steward at the 964 DECISIONS OF NATIONAL LABOR RELATIONS BOARD request of employees. 2. Whether the Respondents had a duty during the time that a contract was in existence but no shop stewards had been designated , pursuant to the provisions of the contract, to call a steward at the request of employees. 3. Whether after the contract was in effect and shop stewards had been duly designated pursuant to its provisions Respondents violated the Act by providing that its foreman at the lowest level should attempt to adjust grievances prior to calling a shop steward and should unilaterally decide whether a shop steward may be called. 4. Whether in the circumstances of the interrogations of the union stewards and shop stewards by the security investigators Respondents had a duty to afford them, at their request, representation by shop stewards during the interrogation. Discussions 1. The statement of the first issue appears to provide its own answer. If there are no shop stewards to be called it is difficult to see how Respondents could have afforded employees an opportunity to consult them. The terms of the contract clearly envision that shop stewards should be appointed in numbers and in areas to be mutually agreed between the parties. Until such mutual agreement is reached, it would seem to be the intent of the parties to the contract, that no shop stewards would officially be recognized by the Employer. The General Counsel and the Charging Party argue that in prior years, when a new contract supplanted an old one, the shop stewards who were recognized under the old contract continued to represent the employees in the areas that they had theretofore convered, and were called at the request of employees when the occasion arose prior to the agreement of the parties under the terms of the new contract. They argue that such should be the case during the period with which we are now here concerned. Certainly the argument has appeal but it fails to recognize one real distinction between the situations that had existed before and that which existed during the period with which we are concerned. Then there was no lapse in the bargaining relationship . In the instant situation, however, there was a lapse of a number of months between the withdrawal of recognition by the Respondents and the resumption of recognition pursuant to the court order. During that interval, according to the testimony of both the Union's witnesses and the Respondents ', considerable changes had taken place. Respondents had set up a "nonunion " grievance procedure pursuant to which it dealt directly with employees who felt that they had a grievance. Departments had closed, new ones had opened, and a considerable number of the shop stewards no longer worked in the areas or departments or on the shifts in which they had previously performed their stewardship. As Respondents pointed out, the implementation of the contract in a plant of 20,000 employees, with a large number of supervisors and managerial employees , required that all the foremen be advised of the identity and the areas of the shop stewards, and that the paperwork necessary for stewards to go from production time to the time allotted by the contract for the handling of grievances, i.e., 2 hours a week, be provided. In general the wheels had to be activated again to handle grievances on a union basis. The General Counsel appears to contend that Respondents deliberately delayed negotiations on the number of stewards and the areas which they should cover in order to prolong the period during which the employees were unexposed to the Union's representative status. However, this is not alleged in the complaint nor on the record before me could I find that it is supported by substantial evidence. Such delays as there were appear to me to be attributable as much to the Union's representatives as to Respondents'. On the whole I must reject this allegation . By the terms of the contract the Union has agreed that the duty to call a steward arises only after certain formalities are met, and the General Counsel has not shown that those formalities had been completed during this period of time. 2. After the contract was signed Respondents were, of course, bound to process grievances through the contractual grievance procedure which included inter alia negotiating at the first step with the union shop stewards. But there were still no stewards. All the considerations that I have expressed with regard to the prior period, when there was no contract, were still existent . I believe that the Union bound itself by its contract to wait out the period until shop stewards had been duly named and no unfair labor practices are shown, absent a finding that the Employer in some way made it impossible to name them or delayed naming them. This allegation too must be dismissed. 3. The third issue presents a difficult problem. The Union complains that the custom, which the evidence reveals to exist at least with some supervisors, is that when an employee asks for the assistance of a steward the supervisor , who is in most cases the person whose activities gave rise to whatever complaint the employee may have, inquires of the employee the reason why he wants a steward. This must have been envisioned by the contracting parties for their contract provides limitations on the circumstances under which stewards are called at the request of employees and provides that the employee make a statement sufficient to identify the problem so that the foreman can determine whether it is within the contractual limitations. The Union complains, however, that the foreman frequently goes further and discusses the potential grievance with the employee even to the point of trying to "talk him out of it" or of remedying the situation if it is one that the foreman for one reason or another prefers should not go through a more formal procedure. Viewed from the standpoint of the Union jealously guarding its prerogative , its complaint may be j ustified. However, in the avoidance of industrial strife which is among the purposes for which this agency was establised, it is hard to find that Respondents, by willingly and without coercion remedying whatever gave rise to an employee's grievance, violate the law. Inasmuch as the parties certainly meant by their contract that the supervisor should make an initial determination whether any particular grievance is cognizable under the terms of the contract and requires that a shop steward be afforded the employee , it would seem that here again the Union has put itself in the position where it must expect that the foreman would ask the employee the details of his grievance . The parties at the hearing gave examples of the type of answer that an employee might make that would clearly reveal to the foreman whether the complaint is a grievable matter or not . But common experience teaches us that the employee will not necessarily speak in clear and unambiguous terms when asked by his foreman the basis of the grievance , and further questioning by the foreman would frequently be necessary to enable him to make the determination required of him. I do not find UNITED AIRCRAFT CORP. 965 that such questioning is violative of the Act. Of course given the situation where foremen are acting in bad faith and refusing to call stewards where they are clearly warranted, a violation is made out. It is this possibility, among others, that the General Counsel argues in his brief. In support of his' argument General Counsel first states that the eight incidents concerning which evidence was adduced at the hearing were a "representative group making testimony of additional employees cumulative."" A brief resume of the incidents upon which the General Counsel rests his allegations is in order at this time. Employee Joseph M. Gleason; a shop committeeman for the Union, was asked by his foreman three times in 2 days to explain the fact that he was in departments other than his own. In each case he had been sent into the other departments on business and was conducting that business. Feeling that he was being'harassed because of his position as a shop committeeman, he determined to file a grievance. He asked his foreman for a shop steward and his foreman refused to furnish one. The foreman was not called as'a witness. However, the assistant superintendent, over that foreman, testified that it was he that determined that a shop steward would not be called and he reached the determination on the basis of his belief that the contract had not been violated. He testified that at his instructions the foreman called the personnel office and was informed by the personnel office that a shop steward need not be furnished because there was no violation,of the contract. During Gleason's conversation with the foreman, he told Gleason that "I'd better talk you out of this or try to talk you out of it." He asked Gleason whether, since Gleason was a committeeman , they couldn't straighten the matter out. In a later conversation the foreman again tried to talk Gleason out of filing a grievance, first representing that he had done Gleason a lot of favors and second stating that Gleason was being foolish, making a mistake, and just causing trouble. There is no question that to harass an employee because of his'position with the Union would substantially affect his working conditions. The contract provides that shop stewards shall be called if the grievances effect employees' working conditions and the employee asked for a shop steward. Here Gleason said that he was being harassed and asked for a shop steward. Apparently all contractual conditions were met but a shop steward was not afforded him. The fact that in the Employer's mind no harrassment had occurred and accordingly no breach of the contract had occurred can hardly be considered to' vitiate the Employer's duty to call the shop steward at the request of the employee. Robert Blair testified that he felt that he was not getting his share of overtime and asked his foreman to call a steward, The foreman declined to do so and said that he had no grievance on overtime and to go back to work. Later that week the foreman, Monty, asked Blair to work the following Saturday . Blair said he still wanted to file a grievance for not receiving a steward when he asked for one. Monty said ,that he had no grievance and to keep working. So he kept working. That night he went to the "The General Counsel pointed out quite correctly that the total number of employees who were denied ' stewards could not in any event ever be determined since it is reasonable to assume that many employees may never have reported the denials to the Union, especially those whose grievances were, adjusted by Respondents contemporaneously with the denials. union hall and filed two grievances, one over Monty's failure to call a steward and the other over the overtime situation. The following week a shop steward came to his department and discussed both grievances with him and with Monty. Monty testified that on the first occasion Blair did not ask for a steward and he told him, "why don't you wait until this weekend and see what the overtime is going to be before you take any action " Blair said "okay" and went back to work. On the second occasion he testified that he told Blair that he was assigned to work the following Saturday and Blair said "That's good. I'll be in but I am still going to enter a grievance." The conversation ended there and according to his testimony Blair had still not asked for a shop steward. On January 12, a week after the first contact, he testified that Blair asked him for a shop steward, that he called his general foreman and the personnel advisors department, and that a shop steward came to his department and discussed the grievance. The two stories of course are directly opposed. I credit Blair . At the close of his direct testimony Monty testified that Blair filed three grievances; one on discrimination, one on overtime, and one on refusal to call a steward. This testimony comports with Blair's testimony that he went to the union hall on the night of the 5th and filed two grievances, and it was as a result of the grievances he filed at the union hall that a steward came to the department on the 12th to handle the grievances. Monty's testimony is inconsistent with his own statement that Blair made no attempt to file grievances on either of the two occasions or to ask for a shop steward and that the shop steward was called by him on the 12th and came immediately. Here, again, we have a situation where the grievance was clearly one contemplated by the contract to be grievable and the employee one for whom a shop steward was to be called. Inasmuch as it is clear that foremen normally do not show overtime records to employees and in fact have a decided disinclination to show them to shop stewards until directed to do so, for the Respondents to handle such a grievance as Monty attempted to do here, i.e., by merely assigning overtime to the grievant, puts neither the employee nor the Union in any position whatsoever to determine whether the assignments have now, or at any given point, resulted in equal distribution of overtime. Such action on the part of Respondents surely must have the effect of denigrating the Union in the eyes of the employees, for the benefits of union representation are denied the employee. Unless the employee goes to the further and contractually unnecessary step of going to the union hall to file grievances the Union is not even apprised of the fact that a problem exists. Paul F. Graves testified that on March 9, 1967, he asked his foreman, John Morigiloni, why a less senior employee was put on a job, which he considered to be better, rather than himself. The foreman told him that he thought it best that the other employee do the job and told Graves that if he needed help in the future he would consider him. A couple of hours later Graves came to Morigiloni and asked for the services of a shop steward. Morigiloni asked why and Graves answered that that was his business . Morigiloni told graves he would try to locate one and "took off." He came back 20 minutes later and said that Graves had no grievable matter and could not have a steward. 966 DECISIONS OF NATIONAL LABOR RELATIONS BOARD Morigiloni did not testify. The conclusion here is very simple. The Union and the Employer have agreed by contract that an employee requesting a steward must inform the foreman why he wanted the steward. While in the instant matter Morigiloni might very well have assumed that Graves wanted to grieve the assignment of the less senior employee, he had no way of knowing it in view of Graves' answer to his direct question. The Charging Party contends that employees have an absolute right to the services of a shop steward on request. We do not reach this issue in this matter because of the contractual commitment by the Union which is clear and unambiguous , at least in this respect, that employees seeking the services of a shop steward will inform the supervisor of the reason therefor. Accordingly, insofar as this incident is alleged to violate the Act, I shall recommend that the allegation be dismissed. Laurier M. Berube, a welder, testified that he was told he was to be loaned to another department temporarily. Believing that he was in danger of losing his "qualification" in brazing, a type of work related to welding but requiring a separate certification in order to work on defense materials , he protested that, inasmuch as he had greater seniority than any other welders, he should not be loaned out so as to endanger his brazing certification.- The foreman insisted that he go to the other department immediately, whereupon Berube asked for a shop steward to file a grievance. The foreman summarily denied his request and told him to go to the other department. An argument ensued which apparently became quite vocal and eventually involved the general foreman. As a result of the argument Berube went to the other department and no shop steward was called. Later Berube went to the union hall to obtain the services of a shop steward on his own time. Foreman Reikhet testified to approximately the same situation except that according to him Berube became somewhat more abusive, in fact threatening to "flaten him." According to him, when Berube took his complaint to General Foreman McAllister, McAllister explained that Berube could pick up his qualification at a later date, there was no ground for a union steward, to go down to the department and see the job, and if he had any complaint to come back. If the job was out of his line, then he could have a union steward. Reikhet admitted that both he and McAllister denied Berube's request for a shop steward because they both felt his grievance had no merit.45 41Berube testified that he feared losing his brazing qualifications because in his 14-1/2 years' service with the Employer he had known employees who had fewer qualifications to be laid off before junior employees with more qualifications He had in the past already lost one qualification in machine welding because a foreman had filed the wrong papers and he feared that losing his brazing qualifications would make him more vulnerable to future layoffs "Reikhet, who was present during the examination and cross-examination of two other foremen and was obviously a fairly quick-witted person, denied that he had received instructions from the personnel department as to what was required of him under the contract and denied that he ever contacted the personnel department when requests were made for stewards by employees. Under cross-examination by by Attorney Ratner he was marvelously evasive, so much so that I am led to believe that his testimony , especially with regard to any contact he may have had with the personnel office, is false Indeed his demeanor was such that not only do I not credit his assertions but I am led to believe that the truth is the opposite of his story. See Dyer v. MacDougall , 201 F 2d 265, 269 (C.A. 2), N.L.R B. v Din Ion Coil Company, 201 F 2d 434 (C A 2), N.L.R B v. Shattuck Denn Mining Corp , 362 F.2d 466, 470 (C.A 9) Clearly this is a situation where the foreman and the general foreman unilaterally reached a determination that the employee's grievance had no merit and for that reason alone declined to furnish him a shop steward It appears that from the employee's viewpoint the point in issue, the possible loss of Berube's qualifications as a brazer and the attendant possibility of greater vunerability in case of a layoff, was a matter closely tied to his hours and working conditions if not his immediate wages. I see nothing in the contract between the parties that gives the Employer the prerogative of predicating calling a steward upon its unilateral determination of merit of the employee's grievance. Respondents contend that Berube lost nothing as a result of the loan of his services to another department inasmuch as he only worked there I day and returned to his own department the next in time to achieve the qualification that he feared losing. However no one told Berube this. As he testified, as far as he knew he could have been loaned out for a period of days, weeks, or months. As I understand the law an employee with a grievance has a right to representation by the union which is his collective-bargaining agent in the handling of that grievance. By contract the Union and Respondents here have agreed on the machinery under which such grievances are to be handled. By denying Berube access to the machinery the Respondents breached not only their contract, but the Act. Michael C Nogas testified that he asked his foreman, Lefebere, for a raise in pay and was refused whereupon he asked for a shop steward to grieve concerning his rate of pay. The foreman told him to go back to work and he did so. About 15 minutes later Lefebere called him to his desk and said "If I was you I would not take this any further" and said that he did not feel that Nogas had a grievance Nogas asked again for a shop steward and Lefebere said if he wanted a shop steward he could see him on his own time or at his lunch hour. Lefebere testified that Nogas came up to him at his desk and said that he wanted a steward. He asked Nogas to repeat it and Nogas said he wanted a steward. Lefebere asked why and Nogas told him it was because he was not getting the job rate. Lefebere started to explain why in his opinion Nogas wasn't getting the job rate and then told Nogas to go back to work and he would explain the whole thing to him later. Later on in the shift Lefebere called Nogas to his desk and explained the entire company procedure with regard to getting a job rate. He testified that, as far as he knew, after his explanation Nogas did not want a steward anymore, although he admitted that Nogas did not say so. The next day according to Lefebere he was informed that a grievance had been filed at the union hall by Nogas and a steward wanted to see him He saw the steward and asked "how come I get the grievance " The steward explained that Nogas had filed it at the union hall.46 It appears to me the situation is exactly like the last preceding one. The employee felt he had a grievance, the grievance was clearly cognizable under the terms of the contract but the foreman decided unilaterally that the employee's grievance lacked merit. That the foreman was, or may have been, in the possession of facts that rendered the filing of a grievance unnecessary is scarely impressive in view of the fact that he chose not to tell Nogas that he had, or was about to, put him in for the wage increase "Lefebere testified that he had , 3 days prior to this incident, put Nogas in for the job rate Nogas testified that he was informed that he was put in for the job rate 3 days after filing the grievance UNITED AIRCRAFT CORP. Lefebere, who had the benefit of having observed other foremen on the witness stand, testified "if the employee wants a steward, he gets a steward, period, whether he's right or wrong." But nevertheless he admitted he did not call a steward. Although Lefebere stated that as a foreman he does not make a decision whether or not an employee will be entitled to a shop steward and that personnel makes such a decision, he testified that he at no time called personnel nor sent them a transmittal note and that he did make the decision. Lefebere also testified that it is the foreman's function to try to settle the grievance with an employee before calling a steward and that only if he fails to satisfy the employee does he give the employee a steward. His testimony is not inconsistent with similar testimony from other foremen and from Personnel Director Morse. I consider that this is a fair statement of the Respondents' policy in this regard I find that the foremen's failure to afford the Union an opportunity to be present at the time an employee's grievance was adjusted, and to handle the grievance for the employee as he requested, is violative of Section 8(a)(1) and (5) of the Act.d7 This situation is distinquishable from that in which the employee comes to the supervisor and states that he is aggrieved by the fact that he has not received a raise or promotion or some other matter and the supervisor, noting that there is validity to the employee's complaint, corrects it. In that instance as I have set forth above, I find no violation, but here where an employee elects to be represented by the Union in handling his complaint and the complaint or grievance is cognizable under the terms of the contract, I believe that the Respondent violates the Act in refusing him the services of a shop steward. Michael Judson testified that on February 4, 1967, he returned from lunch a few minutes late because of automobile trouble. When he returned his card was out of the rack and his group supervisor was at the rack. He called his foreman, White, and asked White to sign him in for 10 minutes past 1, by which time he was at the timeclock. White refused to do so although White had kept him waiting from 1:10 to 1:23 when he returned to the clock. White told Judson to clock in at that time, 1:23. Judson referred to the fact that the group supervisor, Lynda, was present at 10 past when he was there, prepared to clock in, to which White answered that he was not there and he did not have to believe anybody. At this point Judson asked for the services of shop steward and White refused to call one. The following Monday, Judson went to White at his desk and asked for a shop steward so that he could grieve on his timecard. A union steward was present but not a shop steward. White told Judson that he did not have a legal excuse to have a shop steward and to go back to work and Judson did so. The following Friday White apologized to Judson and re-signed the timecard so that Judson was paid for the 15 minutes that he lost as a result of White's former action. The value of the 15-minute period was approximately 78 cents. With regard to Judson, Respondents apparently are of the opinion that he lost his right to a steward because he "failed to meaningfully protect his contractual right by filing a grievance alleging the foreman improperly refused him a steward." Respondents conclude "the facts speak for themselves and argument is unnecessary." Respondents apparently are contending that their contract, which requires that foremen will call a steward under these and similar conditions, does not come into "Bethlehem Steel Company, Shipbuilding Division, 89 NLRB 341 967 play unless and until the employee takes an additional step of going to the union hall and filing a grievance that the Employer has refused to call a steward, thus making two grievances out of one. At other points in the record, and in their brief, Respondents' position seems to be that handling grievances is an expensive matter for Respondents and that they consider themselves harassed to some extent by the grievances filed and that they may be further harassed by the grievances that Respondents fear will be filed if the Union has more shop stewards. This contention of course is in direct contradiction to any contention that an employee must file a second grievance to "protect his right" in filing the first, and should be rejected out of hand. Respondents also belittle Judson's grievance because the money involved was only 78 cents. Perhaps to Respondents with millions of dollars worth of government contracts 78 cents is not very important. Perhaps to Judson, however, 78 cents is important. I have no evidence either way. But the fact is, Judson was aggrieved, asked for a steward, and was denied one. I find a violation as alleged. Robert W. Johnston testified that on January 25, 1967, he went to his foreman and asked for a steward. His foreman, Etchells, asked what the reason was. Johnston said it concerned Assistant Foreman Kacin who was "picking on me" and that he had a few other reasons. Etchells departed and came back and said he would have to know the other reasons, whereupon Johnston stated that one of the reasons concerned Sunday overtime and that he wanted a steward present to discuss the reasons. Etchells walked away and came back a little later with the overtime records. He took Johnston to his desk and showed him where he was wrong because he had worked a day of overtime that he had forgotten about and then started discussing Assistant Foreman Kacin, telling Johnston that Kacin was "a very conscientious man and a great guy to work for." Finally he told Johnston that if he were to call a steward in it might be held against him on his "IE" sheet. Johnston asked if he were to forget his grievance at this point if it would be held against him and Etchells said that it would not Johnston withdrew his request for a steward. Respondents produced no evidence with regard to Johnston and argue that since he withdrew his request shortly after making it, argument is unnecessary. Here we clearly have a situation of a forman handling a grievance with the employee concerned without calling a steward, although requested to do so. As I have found above, this is clearly violative. Respondents however contend that the employee withdrew his request. It is clear that he withdrew his request only after being threatened that it would be held against him on his IE sheet if he persisted in demanding a steward. Johnston testified that at the time he did not know what his IE sheet was. (It appears that it is a time and performance record.) Johnston's reaction, asking the foreman if he withdrew the grievance if it would not be held against him, clearly indicates that he was being coerced by the foreman's threat into withdrawing his grievance. Aside from the Sunday overtime, which is clearly cognizable under the contract, Johnston's decision to grieve against what he deemed to be harassment by the assistant foreman, and his request for support from a shop steward when he did so, is precisely the situation, in my opinion, when an employee most needs the assistance of a union representative. A grievance of this nature is a personal thing between a man and his immediate superior and an employee would necessarily be reluctant to air his grievances without even 968 DECISIONS OF NATIONAL LABOR RELATIONS BOARD the benefit of a friendly witness while he did so. Whether.Foreman Etchells called the personnel office, which I, find to be the customary procedure in circumstances of this type, cannot be ascertained. He obviously consulted with someone during the intervals between the first and second conversation for he came back and said that before he got a steward for Johnston he would have to know the other reasons. Whether he consulted with someone again between the second and third conversation cannot be ascertained from the record. Frank R. Rogerlesci testified that his foreman reprimanded him because he did not do enough work the day before Christmas and told him that he had to do 13 "pieces" a day. Rogerlesci answered that it was impossible to do that many in 8 hours and that 9 or 10 was a good day's work, to which his foreman answered that he wanted 13 or else , explaining "the doors are open; what are you going to do?" The foreman said, "let it go for a couple of weeks and see how much you can improve." Two weeks later the foreman came back to Rogerlesci and said, "Well I see you improved a couple. I think I am satisfied." Rogerlesci answered, "Well look, that ain't the idea. Why don't you get me a shop steward? We'll straightened this thing out." The foreman answered, "I don't think- - -we don't need it. We can straighten it out between you and I." Rogerlesci answered, "That ain't the idea. I just want to prove my point that I can't do what you demanded." The foreman again answered that it was not necessary. Rogerlesci testified that he thought to himself " it's no use arguing the point . If he's satisfied, I'll let it go at that." The foreman did not appear and Respondents contend that Rogerlesci withdrew his request for a steward shortly after making it and that no argument was necessary. I hesitate to make a finding that the Rogerlesci incident constitutes a violation . It is my opinion from viewing Rogerlesci 's demeanor on the witness stand and from his testimony that he knew well that he was in the wrong with regard to the production on the day before Christmas and he also knew well that the foreman's demand that he produce 13 pieces daily was excessive. Accordingly, when 2 weeks later the foreman told him that he might be satisified with the 9 or 10 that Rogerlesci was apparently producing , although Rogerlesci entered into an argument with him during the course of which he called for a shop steward, before the two had stopped arguing he had decided against grieving and was willing to accept the situation as it was . While of course , as I have found above, the foreman had a duty to furnish a shop steward if one was called for under circumstances like this, I think it must have been plain to him that Rogerlesci 's request was made in the heat of debate and his failure to pursue it further , even during the same debate, indicated that Rogerlesci was not interested in proceeding any further. Accordingly - I shall recommend that the complaint be dismissed insofar as this incident is alleged to be a violation. With respect to the eight incidents above, Respondents contend that, if anything, they constitute breaches of contract rather than unfair labor practices, citing Association of Westinghouse Salaried Employees v. Westinghouse Electric Corp., 343 U.S. 437, fn. 2. However, as the General Counsel points out, in many cases the Board has found unfair labor practices which also involved contractual breaches , and I believe that this is one such case . Here we do not have a situation such as Respondents posit where two or three supervisors "may have improperly failed to call stewards upon request during a 2-year period." In most if not all of these cases the foreman acted only after conferring with the personnel office. Presumably the personnel advisors are the spokesmen for Respondents in matters of this nature, and their advice reflects the Respondents' policy. It requires no reach of the imagination to conclude that Respondents' policy is clearly demonstrated by the record here to discourage where possible the filing of grievances, to remedy them if the Employer is clearly wrong, to decline to call a steward for the purpose of filing grievances in situations where Respondents are of the opinion that the grievance is not tenable, or is too insignificant to warrant invocation of the contractual grievance procedure. It is not Respondents' function in such cases to make an initial determination pursuant to which the employee is denied the contractual right to a shop steward. By so acting I am convinced that Respondents have violated the Act by bypassing the Union when an employee has called for a steward, by adjusting grievances under those circumstances without the cognizance of the Union, and by denying its employees the right of representation which the law has provided to them. As I have stated above, I consider that the fact that an employee can grieve the refusal to furnish a shop steward is no defense to the employer. The Denial of Stewards to Employees Being Interrogated in the Plant Security Department 4. The General Counsel contends that Respondents violated the Act by refusing to furnish shop stewards at the request of the employees who were called down to the security offices to be interviewed prior to their discharges. The General Counsel in essence relies on the Board's decision in Texaco , Inc., Houston Producing Division, 168 NLRB No. 49, in which the Board found a violation in that the employer therein refused an employee 's request for a shop steward when faced with an interview by a foreman with regard to the investigation of a matter concerning the employee ' s alleged theft . The facts upon which the employer in Texaco acted were known to management representatives before the interview, and it had concluded its case against the employee . It is clear that the employee was called only to provide a record to support disciplinary action . Under those circumstances the Board found that the employee had a right to representation when he was brought into this situation. In a later case, Jacobe-Pearson Ford , Inc., 172 NLRB No. 84, the Board refused to find a violation where an employee called for a shop steward when he was called in to the company president's office to explain why he had refused to do some work on the prior evening. The employee may have feared that disciplinary action would follow, but the record did not disclose that disciplinary action was normally to be expected, nor that it followed. The Board found that " In view of the absence of any definite adverse action taken on Motes and Respondent's willingness to explain and bargain with the Union any disciplinary decision made, Respondent did not breach any statutory obligation in denying union representation to Motes at the fact-finding meeting of May 5," and dismissed the complaint. The instant case is of course distinguishable on the facts from Jacobe-Pearson Here the Employer in fact ended up invoking the sanction of discharge against the persons who called for a steward , and, as I have found , at least two of the discharges were discriminatory . In addition, in view of the publicity given by Respondents to their stern UNITED AIRCRAFT CORP. 969 enforcement of the -rule against union solicitation, by reading to new employees upon their hire an account of one such discharge, -and by the open and coercive investigations conducted as I have found above, clearly the employees concerned had reason to fear that there was a "potential" for discipline in the meeting . - It avails the Employer nothing to argue that these meetings were not conducted with supervisors but rather were conducted with security investigators,- The internal security department does all the invcstigting, as the investigative arm of Respondents, rather than their supervisors as at Texaco and Jacobe-Pearson. To this extent the internal security investigator supplants, the supervisor and this is so even though the investigator allegedly makes no recommendations with regard to discipline. Furthermore, the instant case is distinquishable from Jacobe-Pearson and like, Texaco in that the, Respondents' investigations of the alleged defalcation were, complete, other than to complete a record to support the disciplinary action to be taken. There can be little doubt that the disciplinary action to be taken was that which was taken, and what little, if any, information the Respondents obtained from the discriminatees added nothing to the knowledge of Respondents concerning the alleged violations. Accordingly, I believe and find that this case is ruled by the Board's rule in Texaco, Inc., supra, and that the refusal to supply shop stewards during the "investigation " in the internal security offices violated the employees' rights as well as the Union's, and thus violated the Act both as to Section . 8(a)(l) and (5). 1 shall recommend a remedy pursuant thereto. IV. THE EFFECT OF ,THE UNFAIR LABOR PRACTICES UPON COMMERCE The activities, of Respondents, set forth in section III, above, occurring in connection with its operations as described in section 1, above, have a close, intimate, and substantial relation to trade, traffic, and commerce among the several States, and tend to lead to labor disputes burdening and obstructing the free flow of commerce. On the basis of the foregoing findings of fact, and upon the record in its entirety, I make the following: CONCLUSIONS OF LAW 1. Respondents are employers within the meaning of Section 2(2) of the Act. 2. The Charging Parties are all labor organizations within the meaning of Section 2(5) of the Act. 3. Local Lodges 1746, 1746-A, and 743, at all times relevant hereto have been the exclusive collective-bargaining agents of the employees in the units set forth in the complaint, at Respondents' plants located in East Hartford and Manchester, Connecticut; Southington, Connecticut; and Windsor Locks and Broad Brook, Connecticut; respectively, within the meaning of Section 9(a,) of the Act, appropriate for collective bargaining. - 4, By dening employees' requests that the Union represent them' at such times as they were interrogated in Respondents' internal security office concerning alleged violations of Respondents ' rules , Respondents violated Section 8 (a)(1) of the Act. 5. By denying the Union the right to represent employees called for , interrogation to Respondents' internal security office concerning alleged violations of Respondents ' rules , and. by refusing to call stewards to assist employees in filing grievances concerning wages, hours, and working conditions and pursuant to the terms of their collective- bargaining agreement, Respondents have violated Section 8(a)(5) and (1) of the Act. 6. By discharging Kenneth Menard and Clifford Nelson and by laying off John W Tardiff because of their activitites on behalf of the Union, Respondents have engaged in and are engaging in unfair labor practices within the meaning of Section 8(a)(3) and (1) of the Act. 7. By interrogating employees concerning their activities on behalf of the Unions, by threats of reprisal to employees for engaging in activities on behalf of the Unions, by the discriminatory application of the employers' rules, and by discrimination in the application of the contractual prohibition of solicitation for union membership or dues Respondents have interfered with, coerced, and restrained employees within the meaning of Section 8(a)(l) of the Act. 8. Respondents have not engaged in other unfair labor practices as discussed above. 9 The unfair labor practices herein found are unfair labor practices within the meaning of Section 2(6) and (7) of the Act. THE REMEDY Both the General Counsel and the Charging Party have suggested particular forms and provisions which they contend are necessary to remedy the unfair labor practices found I have carefully considered their recommendations, and I conclude that the normal remedies granted by the Board in similar cases are adequate here, and the normal posting by Respondents will sufficiently apprise employees of their rights and Respondents' duties with regard hereto. However, in view of the breadth of the violations found herein, and the fact that these are not the first unfair labor practices found to have been committed by Respondents herein, I deem a broad order warranted, and I shall so recommend. I shall further recommend that the Employer offer the employees, named in the attached notice marked "Appendix," immediate reinstatement to their former or substantially equivalent positions without prejudice to their seniority and other rights and privileges, and make them whole for any loss of pay sustained by reason of the discrimination against them including interest at the rate of 6 percent per annum, the computation to be made in the customary manner in accordance with the Board's decision in F. W. Woolworth Co., 90 NLRB 289, with interest as provided in Isis Plumbing & Heating Co , 138 NLRB 716. RECOMMENDED ORDER Upon the basis of the foregoing findings of fact and- conclusions of law and upon the entire record of the case, I recommend the Respondents, United Aircraft Corporation, Pratt & Whitney Division and Hamilton Standard Division, their officers, agents, successors, and assigns, shall: 1. Cease and desist from: (a) Refusing any employee in the units represented by International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers, AFL-CIO, Local Lodges 1746, 1746-A, and 743 representation by shop stewards at any meetings with the Employers' management, supervision, or internal security investigators in which the employee is questioned about, or required to defend himself against his own misconduct 970 DECISIONS OF NATIONAL LABOR RELATIONS BOARD in the course of his duties or occurring on or in relation to Respondents' property where the employee requests representation at the meeting by shop stewards of said labor organizations. (b) Refusing permission to the said labor organizations, or any labor organizations , to attend any meeting and to represent any employee in such meeting who is a member of a unit of which it is the collective-bargaining representative where the purpose of such meeting is to question the employee about or to require him to defend himself against his own alleged misconduct in the course of his duties or occurring on, or in relation to, the Respondents' property where the employee requests representation at the meeting by said labor organization. (c) Refusing to call shop stewards, pursuant to its collective-bargaining agreements with the above-named labor organizations, at the request of any employees in the units represented by said labor organizations, when such employee seeks to have a steward called for the purpose of representation in connection with any grievance concerning wages, hours, or working conditions. (d) Encouraging or discouraging membership in the above-named labor organizations, or any labor organization, by discharging or in any other manner discriminating against employees engaging in concerted or union activities. (e) Promulgating and enforcing rules against talking about the Union or conducting union business on company time in order to interfere with union organization or enforcing such rules while permitting other types of talking or soliciting on company time. (f) Interrogating and threatening employees with reprisals for engaging in activities on behalf of the Union. (g) In any other manner interfering with, restraining, or coercing employees in the exercise of their rights guaranteed in Section 7 of the Act. 2. Take the following affirmative action which will effectuate the policies of the Act: (a) Offer to Kenneth Menard and Clifford Nelson immediate and full reinstatement to their former or substantially equivalent position and make them whole in accordance with the section entitled "The Remedy " Make whole John W. Tardiff for the wages lost as the result of the discrimination against him (b) Preserve and, upon request, make available to the Board or its agents for examination and copying, all payroll records, social security payment records, timecards, personnel records and reports, and all other records necessary to analyze the amount of backpay due under the terms of this Order. (c) Notify the above-named employees if presently serving in the Armed Forces of the United States of their right to full reinstatement upon application in accordance with the Selective Service Act and the Universal Military Training and Service Act, as amended, after discharge from the Armed Forces. (d) Post at its places of business at which units represented by the Charging Parties exist copies of the attached notice marked "Appendix."48 Copies of said notice, on forms provided by the Regional Director for Region 1, after being duly signed by the Company's representative, shall be posted by the Company immediately upon receipt thereof, and be maintained by it for 60 consecutive days thereafter, in conspicuous places, including all places where notices to employees are customarily posted. Reasonable steps shall be taken by the Company to insure that said notices are not altered, defaced, or covered by any other material. (e) Notify the Regional Director for Region 1, in writing, within 20 days from the receipt of this Decision, what steps have been taken to comply herewith.d9 "In the event that this Recommended Order is adopted by the Board, the words "a Decision and Order" shall be substituted for the words "the Recommended Order of a Trial Examiner " in the notice . In the further event that the Board 's Order is enforced by a decree of a United States Court of Appeals, the words "a Decree of the United States Court of Appeals Enforcing an Order" shall be substituted for the words "a Decision and Order " "In the event that this Recommended Order is adopted by the Board, this provision shall be modified to read . "Notify said Regional Director, in writing, within 10 days from the date of this Order , what steps Respondent has taken to comply herewith " APPENDIX NOTICE TO ALL EMPLOYEES Pursuant to the Recommended Order of a Trial Examiner of the National Labor Relations Board, and in order to effectuate the policies of the National Labor Relations Act, as amended, we hereby notify our employees that: WE WILL NOT refuse any employee, represented by a union , representation by shop stewards at any meeting with management, supervisors, or internal security investigators in which the employee is questioned about or required to defend himself against his own alleged misconduct in the course of his duties or occurring at our plant, when the employee requests representation by shop stewards at such meeting WE WILL NOT refuse permission to the International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers, AFL-CIO, Local Lodge 1746, 1746-A, 743, or any other labor organization, to attend any meeting and to represent any employee in such meeting who is a member of any unit represented for collective bargaining by such union, where the purpose of such meeting is to question the employee about or to require him to defend himself against his own alleged misconduct in the course of his duties or occurring at our plant, when the employee requests representation at the meeting by said labor organization. WE WILL NOT refuse to call shop stewards pursuant to our contracts with the above Unions at the request of any employees in units represented by said Unions, when an employee seeks to have a steward called for the purpose of representing him in connection with any grievance concerning wages, hours, or working conditions. WE WILL NOT discourage membership in any labor organization by discharging or otherwise discriminating against employees engaged in union activities. WE WILL NOT make or enforce rules against talking about a union, or conducting union business on company time in order to interfere with union organization, or enforce such rules while permitting other types of talking or soliciting on company time. WE WILL NOT interrogate or threaten employees with reprisals for engaging in union activities. WE WILL NOT in any manner interfere with, restrain, or coerce our employees in the exercise of their rights guaranteed by Section 7 of the Act. WE WILL immediately reinstate stewards Kenneth Menard and Clifford Nelson to their former or substantially equivalent jobs, and pay them any money they lost as a result of the discrimination against them; UNITED AIRCRAFT CORP. 971 and WE WILL -pay John W. Tardiff the wages he lost as a result of our discrimination against him. WE WILL notify the above- named employees if presently serving in the Armed Forces of the United States of their right to full reinstatement upon application in accordance with the Selective Service Act and the Universal Military Training and Service Act, as amended, after discharge from the Armed Forces UNITED AIRCRAFT CORPORATION, PRATT & WHITNEY DIVISION AND HAMILTON STANDARD time. Respondent presented no evidence that they had violated any company rules, but supplied the investigative files which were stipulated to be the documents which were before the person who made the decision to discharge the stewards when the decision was made. Accordingly, the only indication that we have as to the reason for their discharge is the investigative file. The file with regard to DeMerchant and Gahagan indicates on its face that it is a report on Mena Demetrion. It contains alleged statements of employees Demetrion, Jasmin, and Kocal, and the summary sheet therein gives as the classification of the investigation the following: "Miscellaneous (alleged union solicitation during working hours)." Demetrion, Jasmin, and Kocal were not called as witnesses. According to the Dated By investigative files Demetrion and Jasmin are leadmen ' DIVISION (Representative) (Title) This notice must remain posted for 60 consecutive days from the date of posting, and must not be altered, defaced, or covered by any other material. If employees have any question concerning this notice or compliance with its provisions, they may communicate directly with the Board's Regional Office, 20th Floor, John F. Kennedy Federal Building, Cambridge and New Sudbury Streets, Boston, Massachusetts 02203, Telephone 223-3300. SUPPLEMENTAL TRIAL EXAMINER'S DECISION PAUL E. WEIL, Trial Examiner: On August 12, 1968, 1 issued my Decision in the above-titled, consolidated cases reserving for a supplemental decision that part of the issues which had resulted from the General Counsel's fourth amendment to the complaint and which were heard on July 15 and July 22, 1968, at Hartford, Connecticut, with all parties represented by counsel. At the close of the reopened hearing on July 22 all parties waived oral argument and briefs. In conformity with my action in the earlier decision, to which all parties agreed, I shall now proceed to a determination of the deferred 8(a)(l), (3), and (5) allegations. Briefly the fourth amendment to the complaint alleges that Respondent Pratt and Whitney violated Section 8(a)(3) by the discharge of three stewards, Dennis Brandt, Hattie Gahagan, and Winston DeMerchant, all in April 1968, and further violated Section 8(a)(5) by its failure and refusal to call a shop steward at the request of Brandt, Gahagan, and DeMerchant when they were called to the internal security department to be interrogated about the matters which led to their discharges. General Counsel, of course, contends that Section 8(a)(1) is violated by the Respondent derivatively by Respondent's action with regard to the three stewards. Gahagan and DeMerchant Hattie Gahagan and Winston DeMerchant were discharged on April 23, 1968. Hattie Gahagan was told by her foreman that she was discharged for soliciting DeMerchant, although he asked why he was discharged, was not told. A discharge paper subsequently furnished him stated only that he was discharged for violation of company rules. Both Gahagan and DeMerchant testified that they had not violated company rules and particularly that they had at no time solicited for union membership on company (Employer) As I have stated, Hattie Gahagan testified that she had never solicited for the Union on company time. Respondent produced no evidence whatsoever that she had done so. The only indication on the record that Respondent had any reason to believe that she had done so is in the investigative file, in the statement of Mena Demetrion. Mrs. Gahagan appeared completely truthful. Indeed, one of Respondent's witnesses, Ann Steves, unwittingly corroborated her, testifying "I joined the Union for Hattie just because she was a darned nice person and she explained things to me and she wouldn't do anything on company time." As I see it I have no credibility issued to decide in this matter. Mrs. Gahagan appeared truthful and denied the violation of company rules for which she was discharged. Respondent adduced no evidence that she had in fact breached any rule, and chose to rely on the contents of the investigative file, which evidence was placed before a discharging official but not the truth of its contents. Either the Employer did not believe the file and willfully discharged Mrs. Gahagan, an effective and successful union steward, for discriminatory reasons, i.e., because of her effectiveness, or discharged her because it erroneously believed that she had engaged in misconduct. In the former case the violation is manifest, for an employer may not discharge an employee because of her effectiveness as a shop steward If in the latter alternative, the rule is well settled that when an employee has engaged in protective activity and is discharged because of the employer's good-faith but mistaken belief that the employee engaged in misconduct, the discharge violates Section 8(a)(1) of the Act 2 Inasmuch as either alternative results in a finding that the discharge of Gahagan is violative of the Act and the remedy, whether it be under Section 8(a)(3) under the former alternative, or Section 8(a)(1) under the latter, is the same, I find it unnecessary to decide whether Respondent in fact had a good-faith but mistaken belief that Gahagan had violated the rule against solicitation. 'Normally the investigative file indicates that the report is made on the person charged with the alleged breach of rules In this case Demetrion's name appears rather than that of DeMerchant and Gahagan , although DeMerchant and Gahagan were obviously the subjects of the investigation The reason for this may be found in the fact that Demetrion was the subject of an earlier ivestigation as a result of a grievance filed by an employee whom Demetrion allegedly had struck and injuried on the job One of Demetrion 's statements revealed that he blamed DeMerchant for instigating the filing of a grievance by an employee through Shop Steward Gahagan which led to the investigation . What, if any, action was taken as a result of the investigation of Demetrion is not revealed 'Ownes-Corning Fiberglass Corporation , 172 NLRB No. 20; N.L R B V. Burnup and Sims, 379 U S. 21. 97 2 DECISIONS OF NATIONAL LABOR RELATIONS BOARD DeMerchant's position is the same as Gahagan's. He too testified credibly that he had not engaged in solicitation during working hours and Respondent produced no evidence to the contrary. So for the same reason as that set forth above with regard to Gahagan, I find that DeMerchant's discharge violates either Section 8(a)(3) or 8(a)(1) of the Act.' Dennis Brandt With regard to the third alleged discriminatee, Dennis Brandt; the story is somewhat different. Here again Respondent produced no evidence other than the investigative filed. However Brandt himself on the witness stand testified that he had solicited employees during "break" periods such as the time spent washing up in the men's room before lunch and before the close of the day, and the time spent at the timeclock or standing around waiting to go to lunch or to go home in the evenings. Respondent has contended throughout this proceeding that this is "company time" for which the employees are paid by the Employer, and accordingly the contractual provision that there shall be no soliciting for union membership or collection of dues, as well as the no-solicitation rule, adheres. I have considered this position taken by Respondent in the initial Decision herein, and, based on the Board's Decision in Plasticoid Company. 168 NLRB No 26, 1 have rejected it. The record is clear in the latter part of this hearing as well as in the earlier, that employees are permitted by management to take their relief when necessary, to break early at lunch and at quitting time in order to clean up and prepare to go home, and that during such periods of time they are permitted to talk on any subject with the exception of the Union. In his examination, however, Brandt testified that he had in fact, as the investigative file indicated, broken another-rule of the Employer in pasting union stickers to the walls in the men 's room. While the investigative folder for Brandt states on its-,face that the investigation was conducted with regard to an allegation of solicitation for union membership during working hours, both the synopsis and one of the statements contained in the file refer to the posting of the union stickers on the walls in the men's,room. The employees' manual sets forth rules against posting written material on walls, machines, etc., as well as disfiguring the walls and machines. Brandt testified that other stickers had been posted at various times in the men's room but he did not know whether the Employer was aware of the identity of the person who posted them, nor whether any disciplinary action had been taken with regard thereto. According to the employee manual, a breach of the rules with regard to such matters is cause for discharge. The General Counsel adduced no evidence that Respondent dealt discriminatorily with Brandt in regard to the rule or in fact that Respondent at any time had identified an employee who did breach the rule 'The "facts" upon which the Employer's decision was allegedly based with regard to DeMerchant included some corroboration of Demetrion's allegation that DeMerchant had solicited during working hours This was in the "statement" of Theodore Kocal that DeMerchant- had accosted him in the men's room and at the timeclock prior to lunch Of course as I have set forth in the principal Decision , I do not believe that the no-solicitation rule reaches nonworking time of this nature Accordingly , assuming that Respondent based the discharge upon Kocal's statement, the discharge would be violative of Sec. 8(a)(3) On the state of the record, in view of the stipulation with which the investigative file was received, I cannot determine whether Respondent's decision to discharge Brandt was based upon the alleged solicitation or the breach of the rule against defacing the walls in the men's room. I have no reason to believe that either rather than the other or both gave cause for the discharge. To infer that the Respondent discharged Brandt because of his alleged breach of the no-solicitation rule would be to infer that Respondent engaged in an illegal act, whereas to infer that Respondent discharged Brandt because of the defacement rule would be to infer that Respondent acted lawfully. In the face of two conflicting inferences I am constrained to infer legality rather than illegality, even though Respondent herein has demonstrated its willingness to act unlawfully in other situations. Under all the circumstances herein I find that the General Counsel has not sustained the burden of proof with regard to the discharge of Brandt, and I shall recommend that the complaint, insofar as it alleges a violation in his discharge, be dismissed The General Counsel in his presentation of evidence in the reopened hearing adduced testimony from Brandt concerning a large number of solicitations conducted in Brandt's department during working hours for the collection of money for Christmas gifts and other gifts for foremen and leadmen as well as for employees who had suffered illness or death in the family. On cross-examination Brandt named, to the best of his ability, the alleged solicitors and the occasions on which the solicitations were made. Each of the individuals alleged to have engaged in the solicitations as well as the foremen and leadmen alleged to have been the beneficiaries thereof were called to the witness stand by Respondent, and, without exception, each denied soliciting during company time, or in the case of the foremen and leadmen knowing of solicitation during company time.4 The credibility issues thus raised would be difficult to decide. Brandt and some of Respondent's witnesses appeared fairly credible. Others of Respondent's witnesses were evasive or unresponsive and one or two of them couched their denials in such form that I do not believe them. On the other hand no evidence was adduced by the General Counsel that Respondent's officials had any knowledge that the solicitations had taken place, except in one instance where Brandt testified that a foreman had contributed during working hours, which was specifically denied by the foreman.' I do not feel called upon to resolve these credibility issues. The record of the case-in-chief reveals many instances of solicitation conducted during working hours, some of which were obviously done with the knowledge of the supervisor. Respondent acknowledges that it not only condoned but furthered solicitations for certain charitable enterprises which were conducted during working hours, 4The specitic instances of solicitation of Brandt to which he testified, he was approached at his machine during working hours, were not specifically denied 'Clearly the foreman must have known of the solicitation for contributions to the gift which the foreman received, and clearly such solicitations breached the rules, for Respondent has a rule against supervisors receiving gifts from the employees whom they supervise There is no indication in the record that any investigation was made of the breach of this rule except the pretrial investigation conducted between July 15 when Brandt 's evidence was heard and July 22 when the employees were called to testify That investigation was conducted by Personnel Advisor Dominic Cordone, who admittedly called each of the employees named by Brandt into his office, informed them that they had been accused of soliciting during working hours, and heard their denials. UNITED AIRCRAFT CORP. 973 and in fact such solicitations were made in the departments with which we are here concerned, as well as the other departments in the plants. However in view of my conclusion that the no-solicitation clause in the contract has the effect of revitalizing the no-solicitation rule set forth in the employee manual to the extent of solicitation for union membership or dues, I consider that it is not necessary to determine whether a discriminatory enforcement of the rule was conducted in this department. Accordingly I make no findings with regard thereto. The 8(a)(5) Allegation The General Counsel contends that, by its refusal to call shop stewards at the request of Brandt, Gahagan, and DeMerchant when they were called for interrogation to the internal security department, Respondent violated Section 8(a)(5) and (1) of the Act. The record discloses that since the events which were considered in the principal Decision herein both Respondent and the Union have established new guidelines for the individuals concerned in the interrogation process. The first revelation of these guidelines, as far as the record reveals, took place when Brandt was called to the security office on April 10. Before Brandt went to the internal security office he asked that a shop steward be called, but his foreman declined to do so saying that Brandt did not know what the internal security wanted to talk to him about. When Brandt reported to the internal security office he was met by two investigators, Benton and Driscoll, who told him that they had a complaint that he had been doing union business on company time and asked if Brandt had been signing people up on company time. Brandt asked for a shop steward and was told that they could not grant or deny him a shop steward.6 Brandt then told the investigators that he was not' refusing to answer the questions but would write them down and take them to his attorney and bring back an answer. The investigators declined to permit him to do this stating that he would have to answer the questions or remain silent. The investigators called in Supervisor Connolly who informed Brandt that he had to either answer the questions or remain silent. Brant said he would remain silent. They then sent him back to his department. He worked until about 12:20 at which time his foreman told him. "we understand you were down to internal security and you refused to answer the questions." Brandt answered that he wasn't refusing to answer, that he would write, the questions down and bring them the answers. The foreman said, "You can't do this you've got two choices, go *dbwli there and answer the questions or go home." Brandt went home. That night he checked with the Union and they told him to go in the next day and if it appeared that he would jeopardize his employment by refusing to answer the questions that he should do so. The next day Brandt reported to work and found that his timecard was not in the rack. He asked the foreman for the timecard and the foreman said, "I don't know if I can give it to you, I'll have to check." Brandt then walked down to the internal security office with the foreman and told the investigators that he was going to answer the questions. Benton and another investigator, whom he identified as Jordon but appears to have been Johnson, were there. Brandt again asked for a steward and Benton 'Security Investigator Johnson testified to the same affect He stated that the investigators have no "authority" to call a shop steward, that only the foremen can do so..For some reason he did not appear to believe that this was tantamount to a refusal to call a shop steward said, "I told you yesterday you could not have one." Brandt then again asked to copy the questions down and bring them to the steward and said that he was directed by the Union to listen to the questions. The investigators proceeded to question him about whether he had been signing people up on company time, and whether he went to the men's room and talked about the Union on company time. He answered "no" to both questions whereupon Benton said, "Well we have a witness that said you were up to the men's room talking about the Union on company time, are you calling him a liar?" Brandt answered "yes" to that question. They asked him whether he passed out wage cards on company time and he denied doing so. They asked him a number of other questions all of which he answered. They then wrote up a statement for his signature and asked him to sign it. He took exception to the language of the statement, stating that in the first place he was not there voluntarily but there only because he was told to answer the questions or he could not work. He then pointed out that he was not without fear because he was in fear of losing his job. He was threatened either to come down to the internal security office or not return to work. The investigators told him to read the whole statement through and then they would return and cross out the portions to which he took exception. They read it through and the investigators asked whether he was going to sign it. Brandt asked whether he was going to get a copy and the investigators said no. Brandt declined to sign it and returned to his department. Later that day he was discharged for "violation of company rules " The next incident took place when DeMerchant was called to be interviewed at the plant security office on April 23. Before he went there he asked for a shop steward and his foreman refused to send for one. At internal security he was interviewed by two internal security agents, Johnson and Krieger. He asked them for a shop steward and they declined to provide one on the ground that they were not authorized to do so. They asked him whether he had solicited on company time and he took out a pocket notebook and proceeded to write the questions down. He told them that he proposed to write down the questions and take them to someone from the Union and return an answer to them. Johnson said, "You're not going to answer the questions?" DeMerchant answered, "I never refused to answer the questions." Again Supervisor Connolly was sent for and came in and asked DeMerchant, "You're not going to answer the questions." DeMerchant told him that he did not refuse to answer the questions but explained that he wanted to take them to the Union. The interview was terminated and DeMerchant was sent back to his department. At 3.15 that afternoon he was told by his foreman that he was discharged. Hattie Gahagan was called to the internal security office apparently during the time that DeMarchant was being interrogated. She was accompanied there by her supervisor, Charron, who left her at the office. She waited briefly and was then called in and interrogated by two internal security investigators whom she did not name. However, it appears that they were Johnson and Krieger. They told Mrs. Gahagan that the had been accused of soliciting and she answered "that's ridiculous I have been warned not to do that." They asked whether she would be willing to sign a statement to that effect and she said "it sounds to me that you have a grievance against me and if you have I'd like to have union representation here." They told her that they could not do that. She then asked to copy down the statement they wanted her to sign or the 974 DECISIONS OF NATIONAL LABOR RELATIONS BOARD questions and she would take them to the union representative and- bring them back. She stated that she was not refusing to sign, she just wanted a chance to go over them with the union representative. One of the internal security men shrugged his shoulders and said "we're at a standoff." Once again Connolly was called in. He said, "Am I to understand you don't want to answer these questions at this time, but you'd like to copy them and take them over to a union representative or a shop steward or a union steward or a lawyer or something and have them go over them with you." She answered, "Yes." Connolly then said "but you don't refuse to answer the questions?" She answered, "No." Connolly then said, "Well I guess we are at a standoff," and told her to go back to her job. She did and was discharged that afternoon for soliciting. I have discussed, in the principal Decision in this matter, the law as I see it with regard to interrogations such as those set forth above and I have found that in the interrogations considered therein the employer violated Section 8(a)(5) and (1) of the Act by its action in calling the employees to the internal security office, refusing them representation, and interrogating them concerning the alleged violation. I see nothing in the three incidents set forth herein to distinguish them from those I found violative in the earlier case. Again we have the following factors present: 1. The employer's investigation with regard to each of the three stewards was already complete. The investigation obviously was being conducted only for the purpose of completing a paper record to support disciplinary action. The proof of this fact is that none of the three stewards told the investigators anything supportive of the matters alleged against them and two of the three denied the allegations of which they were accused. Nevertheless each of the three was discharged on the day of the investigation. 2. The interrogations were conducted under duress. Brandt, the first one with which we are concerned was in fact laid off for part of a day because he refused to answer questions and was told that he could not return to work until he answered the questions. The Respondent has made no showing that this was not in fact the rule or that it has been changed. Also, each of the three stewards were aware of the fact that they were in danger of losing their jobs because of the allegations made against them and their knowledge of the action that Respondent had taken with regard to other shop stewards under similar circumstances, which were litigated in the earlier part of the proceeding. 3. Each of the stewards asked for and was denied representation by a shop steward. Two of them, Brandt and DeMerchant, asked their foremen before they went to the internal security office and all three of them asked the internal security investigators. The alleged rule that internal security officers have no "authority" to call shop stewards is no defense to Respondent. They obviously have authority to call the foreman who may call a shop steward and their refusal to provide a shop steward was tantamount to a refusal of representation.' There can be little doubt that within the Board's rule in Texaco' Respondent's actions with regard to the interrogations of the three stewards violate Section 8(a)(1) and (5) of the Act and I so find. It is conceivable that Respondent could argue that it was the refusal of the employees to answer questions or to sign statements that caused their discharge. That a rule existed that such refusal was ground for discipline would appear from the actions taken with regard to Brandt when he originally refused to answer the questions until he had conferred with union authorities. The Respondent neither by its answer nor by evidence revealed what it considered to be the cause of discharge and the General Counsel made no effort to ascertain which alleged rule violations resulted in the discharges.' This defense, if raised, could avail Respondents nothing. The interrogations were unlawful as I have found and a discharge for refusal to submit to such a coercive unlawful interrogation violates Section 8(a)(1) and (3) of the Act. ADDITIONAL CONCLUSIONS OF LAW By discharging Hattie Gahagan and Winston DeMerchant because of their activities on behalf of the Union and in order to discourage union membership, Respondent has violated Section 8 (a)(1) and (3) of the Act. I do not deem it necessary to make additional conclusions of law with regard to the other violations found inasmuch as the conclusions in the principal Decision herein adequately represent my findings in the Supplemental Decision. THE REMEDY Having found that Respondent unlawfully discharged Hattie Gahagan and Winston DeMerchant I recommend that Respondent be ordered to offer these employees immediate and full reinstatement to their former or substantially equivalent positions at Respondent's East Hartford facility without prejudice to their seniority or other rights and privileges and make them whole for any loss of pay they may have suffered as a result of their discharge by payment of sums of money equal to those they would have earned as wages from April 23, 1968, the date of their discharge, to the date of Respondent's offers of reinstatement less their net earnings during such period computed quarterly with interest in accordance with the formula prescribed in F. W. Woolworth Company, 90 NLRB 289, and Isis Plumbing & Heating Co, 138 NLRB 716. Inasmuch as this is a Supplemental Decision and the principal Decision in this matter, heretofore issued, contains a Recommended Order with provisions for the remedy of every allegation found to be violative in this Supplemental Decision,for the sake of clarity and brevity I shall not repeat my Recommended Order nor provide for a second notice to be posted. I recommend however that the Recommended Order be amended by adding to paragraph 2(a), after the name Kenneth Menard, the names Hattie Gahagan and Winston DeMerchant I further recommend that the notice be amended by 'Investigator Johnson whose testimony was extremely evasive and frequently incredible contended that there was no refusal as such to call a shop steward. I regard his contention as nothing but a cynical evasion of the fact. 'Texaco, Inc, Houston Producing Division, 168 NLRB No 49 'Hattie Gahagan testified that she was informed that her discharge was for soliciting The other stewards were not informed UNITED AIRCRAFT CORP. 975 including the names Hattie Gahagan and Winston With regard to the allegation that Dennis Brandt was DeMerchant in the reinstatement and make-whole discharged in violation of Section 8(a)(3) of the Act, I provisions in the same fashion. recommend that this allegation be dismissed Copy with citationCopy as parenthetical citation